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...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI...

Discussion in 'The Dogs' started by ELIAS'PISTOLA, Apr 18, 2016.

  1. CajunBoulette

    CajunBoulette CH Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    I have one or my brother one that has Tiverton in the PED. It's funny you brought up the Chinaman/Paddy cross I was just looking at that earlier while tracing some Earl and Earl Jr dogs
     
  2. CajunBoulette

    CajunBoulette CH Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    I was looking at the difference in the breeding that produced Frank White and the one that produced Rat and Susie
     
  3. niko

    niko CH Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    I've got some of the paddy dog through Garners hickson dog...linebred lever red...I like it
     
  4. Thunder98

    Thunder98 Big Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    I appreciate that EP, nice reads.!!! & thread
     
  5. ELIAS'PISTOLA

    ELIAS'PISTOLA CH Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    thanks for sparking some thought towards so many different facets of patricks dogs,,,
    I assume the amount of ingrediants is listed in order from most to less for a reason...

    With that being said I intended for this to be more a Bolio/Tombstone thread as opposed to Tombstone/Bolio,,,
    but put the name patrick on it and it dont matter how mich shows in the pedigree
    but rather what phenotype they take after most...

    In these studies I often wonder and spark the same in those I ask,,,
    if the dog looks alot like a throwback to say bolio,,,
    do they also have both the athlethic ability and producing ability,,,
    or at least one or the other???

    or do they just "LOOK" like the great great grandparent???

    Ive heard multiple answers and take into account old family breeders theories first and foremost as they have carried a line such as I did with TDK on this forum...

    I take on people like Mr Ratliff and Mr Hargrroves years of experience coupled with a mastered eye,,,
    second as they have witnessed more types in the field...

    ever body else I take with a grain of salt and open wound...

    Out of the people I trust,,, I have heard both types of throwbacks pop their heads,,,
    ones that look alike and might have the athleticism but no ability or might not carry the golden sperm like them,,,
    some come in different colors or builds which kills the "look" phenotypes theory as the carry both athletic and
    or producing abilities...

    the genotype is probably the key and I am sure they will able dna test for it before long
    and those whom carry that "speed gene" will be sought and bought for large sums,,,
    they might have to change division amongst those that carry it and those that dont ...

    that would make for two things,,,
    the absolute best go into the best and get bred and evolve isolating the gene...
    and that the compition is fare which should make for better shows and over all bulldog in both divisions
    or evan three for ziggy...


    with that being said,,,

    I think that those hollingsworth dogs are some of the best tombstone dogs,,,


    the dogs that otter,,, skipper and mrhhargroves had of tonka/tomstone and clouse blood
    also very game dogs with a high percentages but when you got a good one like gr ch hellbend
    they are very hard to beat...

    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [39800] :: <B><FONT COLOR=GREEN>GATORBOYS' KRISS (2XW)
    kris kross was bought some local boys in the hood as a two timmer,,,
    as if the gator boys arent to be trusted the boys in the hood rolled the dog for hours n end with multiple dogs and won over half a dozen otcs before they under conditioned him and travelled a good distance with out anytime off,,,
    all odds staked kris was picked up game in two hours by a frisco fancier whom never seen a gamer dog
    and offered to pay half the loss to try and the dog...he was said to have over twenty four hours of combined schooling,,, matches,,, game test and last match and all of his matches were close to two hours if I remember correctly and was truley a rare type of dead game dog as every outing he pulled from behind,,,
    a staple in those hollingsworth and hellbend bred dogs...

    Damn if those boys in the hood were up to no good and are not dead now like their game bulldog they didnt value...

    I think the more true tombstone dogs from oklahoma in its many different facets
    as tudor liked em with more of hid blood perhaps as an influence such as the clouse genotype in the others...
    the okie tombstone dogs seem to be the highest calibre with the typical durable build but not such a high percentage of game dogs as the other two tombstone families,,, perhaps because it lacked the game old Clouse blood the other two families carried...
    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [111708] :: ANDERSON'S CH BENNY BOB

    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [11542] :: ANDERSON'S BILLY

    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [8905] :: BRYANT'S DIABLO

    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [104531] :: GAMEFINDER'S CHANGO
    lost to...
    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [30771] :: JERSEY BOYS SARGE
     
  6. ragedog10

    ragedog10 Top Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    If the Gator Boys or Boy were breeders they would of had a solid line of dog's by. Ch.Mike is said to be monster by all who have saw him and word is a few of kids are looking really good. Alot of good Tonka x Bolio x Yellow dogs were shown by them again to bad they weren't breeder's
     
  7. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    'throwbacks'...I bred a Snooty-Molly Bee bitch to Kasai. The female out of that back to Patrick's Anvil. In that litter there was a female that was the spitting image of Dirty Mary, right down to the blue eye.


    Grew up and did not amount to much at all.


    Go figure.


    S
     
  8. ELIAS'PISTOLA

    ELIAS'PISTOLA CH Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    nice read slim,,, Ive seen a throwback but not a litter of them...

    I had a little bitch that looked like dirty mary also from the squat build to the blue eye,,,
    but the blue eye and patch were on the other side,,, a real mirror reflection!!!lol...

    I told the old man where I keep my dogs grandchildren about my dirty mary throwback,,,
    and the little fuckers stole her before I could let her mature into more than just looks...


    I notice alot of concern into how a dog isnt bred a certain way due to the color,,,
    i.e... redboy being red and ch ninja off jeep being black etc for examples...

    In my studies unless you isolate all genes such as mr mayfield did/attempted
    so that he family breeds up similar or the same with slight or no variances in phenotypes,,,

    that most families will pull a throw back from very far back in the ped such as the dirty mary phenotypes
    both Slim and I have experienced...

    making me doubt the way a dog is bred because of colors or looks,,,
    on the other end of the spectrum I have seen a bolio throwback that looked nothing like any dogs in the family for many many generations and perhaps back to source bolio himsef...
    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [289393] :: MTN BOY'S JAKE

    you would think this just came on as a throwback and that his offspring would resort back to the immediate families looks,,, but rather this bolio phenotype might have also been bolios genotype as he produced the same color dogs as well as acting as he genes seemed to over power others...

    this seems odd because they are nothing like the immediate family in looks and speed,,,
    but a black or chocolate mayfield dogs always bred true to the isolated genes...

    same with alot of vengeance and mudnight dogs,,, strong genes that over power others gene pools...

    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [84441] :: <font color=maroon>TDK'S CASEY CASH
    the bolio dog above grandpa casey cash looked the polar oppisite,,,
    a sluggish looking black dog that looked alot like an aligator dog which isnt odd as he is linebred on...
    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [8640] :: GILMAN'S SISSY

    its odd that this aligator look skipped the jakedogs offspring and next generations that are mostly red like him...
     
  9. ELIAS'PISTOLA

    ELIAS'PISTOLA CH Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    thanks for the read,,, I suppose you are talikng about this mike???
    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [340348] :: GATORBOYS CH. MIKE 5XW


    as opposed to this other great mike,,, a true super producer and brother to champion slickhead and others...
    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [106938] :: CH. ANT318'S (TM&CM) MIKE (3XW)

    his sire carried and passed those butkus and bodine traits...
    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [8783] :: CATCHIN WRECK'S(DOG BOY'S) BAMBOO (2XW)
    a pre potent uncle to niece breeding with bodine for the out made for a great all around bulldog...

    alot of times those at the core such as the gator boys become some of the best breeders such as mr ratliff...

    I remember when the pubically outted kyree of march or die kennels for selling them hanky panky
    as a deep game dog and she pulled up on them in a show in under a half hour,,,
    to boot kyree offered them a pup off hanky as a replacement...
    ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [69294] :: MARCH OR DIE'S (GATOR BOYZ) HANKY PANKY

    they were serious no bs type bulldoggers and were quick to call it for what it was,,,
    I admire that and would trust their word about a bulldog over most...
     
  10. ragedog10

    ragedog10 Top Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    There's actually a very good grandson of TM & CH( Ma Boyz) Mike who is really making a name for himself.. But there was another bitch off Mike to some Little Gator blood and she bad as was her brother Ch.Stryker.. We always preferred the Bolio blood crossed to Eli x Carver seemed to be more complete dogs'. But yes I was talking about the other Ch.Mike last time we were at Gator Boys place he had 5-6 bitches from Stone City there to bred to him.
     
  11. Naustroms

    Naustroms CH Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    There's one off Miss Blondie who I've heard nothing but good this about. Was always a fan of the Mike stuff was supposed to get fubolito. Was also gonna breed to Papi. Unfortunately both those fell through.
     
  12. ragedog10

    ragedog10 Top Dog

    Re: ...Patricks INVICTO,,, Patricks HOT DOG,,, Patricks RICK RUDE & Patricks SENDAI..

    That's the son I'm talking about, put together his last for them. Side note Titere seems to be clicking with with Bolio type bitches really well.
     
  13. TROTLINE

    TROTLINE Top Dog

    I know this is off subject but I was just looking at some of my old friend Orbie Coplands line after he passed. In the mid 70's if you had A tight line of dogs, especialy off Colby Corvino and Feely he had some of the best line bred Dibo, Arizona Pete, and Hienzels best bred tight! I wish I knew then what I know now, after he passed his line was scattered to the wind! Of coarse they had no ability BUT they would stay forever!!!! A lot of his stuff wasn't registered! Oh well makes no difference now!! Sorry for the hi jack but didn't want to start A whole thread on this!!
     
  14. ELIAS'PISTOLA

    ELIAS'PISTOLA CH Dog

    That Tiverton and paddy type dogs really counter those eli chinaman dogs,,, and vice versa...
    I am sure earl or frisco fans would rather take it to some chinaman blood but
    I prefer some eli but heavier on the bolio tombstone or jeep redboy or redboy/jocko...
    check that litter off Tiverton to the super producer redboy jocko/paladin bitch,,, and check her production elsewhere...
    http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=2428
    The three brothers off tiverton ex daisy were by far the best,,,
    the champion off frisco ex daisy was great and that redboy dog added some bottom in farnk but most other were culled,,, hmm linebred eli???
    no champions off the rutkus ex daisy breeding but a highest percentage game dogs,,, hmm linebred redboy???
    the breeding of the 5x wacko dog was very low percentages,,,
    wacko beat some breat dogs including a champion but quit against ch kunta and let every one down,,,
    his offspring were even more of a let down from what I understand...
    http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=122342
    http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=29933
    bred very similar,,, I guess boyles gets the credit for both like old times and patricks is behind it all,,,
    as he followed in tudors steps of not feeling his worth...
     
  15. stinkrock

    stinkrock Top Dog

     
  16. stinkrock

    stinkrock Top Dog

    We all feel like kicking our selfs in the ass one time or another .
     
  17. ELIAS'PISTOLA

    ELIAS'PISTOLA CH Dog

  18. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Lots of Bakari's dogs ended up being scatter bred. He bred good dogs to good dogs. We had one down out of his Scary Chick blood. A little Deloach blood and a little Tyrone. Bitch stayed in the dog box 23:55 per day. She would not eat until all the other dogs had finished, we were back in the house and the coast was clear. She would pop out, eat, piss and shit. Right back in the house. Take her off the chain and put her in a box was an entirely different story. Tons of mouth and tons of finish.

    S
     
    ELIAS'PISTOLA likes this.
  19. ELIAS'PISTOLA

    ELIAS'PISTOLA CH Dog

    I heard of some of those Tyrone dogs to be skittish,,,
    a friend seen Tyrone go and said he was very devestating...
    If i recall my buddy said that the same night Bakari had shown Tyrone
    he showed another champion related to Tyrone that ended up quiting and cur snapping at the handler...
    Slim,,, do you recall this dog as I forgot his name???
     
  20. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    I will ask tomorrow. I have not talked to Bakari in a number of years. I thought him to be straight up about the dogs.

    Tyrone could shut it down. One thing that could be counted on with that group. They liked mouth and they would pay $$$$$ to have mouth. If they were standing across the way one would be wise to get the medical care set up and ready.

    Not sure about which one.

    S
     

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