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Canine Athletes Conditioning Feed Plan

Discussion in 'Dog Discussion' started by CanineAthletes, Apr 15, 2018.

  1. promoe

    promoe Premium Member Premium Member

    very good slim...phenotype does play a role idc what people think. the "throwbacks" make ya giggle..ears,coat or tail you know what you can expect. especially when dealing with a certain bloodline for years.

    to old dog I have some experience in the wise's stuff....game plugs weren't what we had here. they acted like they wanted it but hardly stayed for dessert. they were a great catalyst with a few lines but they were tricky to breed around.

    as for Willie he is bred for performance..if you know the folks behind his ped then you would have a little more understanding. he wouldn't be something I would base a yard off of. but he could add something to your line of animals. I have been trying to breed one of my retarded males a to something down from him but keep getting the same story on how they would be to crazy. maybe plowboy will chime in on this thread.
     
    oldguy likes this.
  2. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Pedigrees&file=printPedigree&dog_id=169436

    I had the littermate to this dog. We called him Red Roy. One of the most freak mouthed dogs I have ever seen. He had teeth that looked like 20-penny nails and he sunk them deep and then shredded on the way out. He was a thick hided, rough ass inbred Red Boy dog down from the Deacon strain and as intense and crazy as any Red Boy dog ever.

    Red Roy was going to be the next great thing. All that Red Boy piled up with mouth to boot. He could have been the next Red Boy cash cow. He splattered one and then decided he had done all he had come to do.

    But so goes the Red Boy line.

    S
     
    Carolinacur likes this.
  3. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    Slim/Promoe/Holocaust thanks for your input, I appreciate it! No intention of stirring controversy over RB pedigree, as Slim said, "moot point" and I hardly look further back in a pedigree than 3 generations anyway :) Interesting what Promoe said about the Wise dogs, complete contrast to what we had here! Thanks again guys!
     
    Holocaust likes this.
  4. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Not that I have experience with the Wise dogs personally, but I'm guessing they are just like any other line.

    Some stay. Some do not. Some deliver. Some do not.

    Take the Red Boy strain. There is good and bad in every strain. But due to its popularity it is the most peddled family ever. The advertisement "PURE RED BOY" is a killer selling point, as if it will cure all that ails a bulldog family. It is a guarantee of all-nite game dogs but that is only perception, not fact.

    What happens is the breeders breed for different reasons. And when an individual chooses a combination to be bred the original breeder may have went another direction. Thus strains. All Red Boy dogs are not Red Boy dogs, if that makes sense. Just like all Wise dogs are not Wise dogs.

    Once they are bred by someone other than the original breeder things start to change. Sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse.

    I'm a fan of the Mims family of Red Boy dogs. I was never a big fan of the Holland strain. Others were. I saw so many that were small boned, thin coated, less than durable game plugs, and some not so game at all. My best guess is a lot went in checked being sold as "PURE RED BOY" dogs. But at the same time they were Red Boy dogs.

    If KM and RB, more KM than RB had continued the Red Boy strain the way they did back then and did not have that break in time...Red Boy dogs would be stand on their own dogs a lot more so than they are now. As a family, of all the strains, and although it does bring a lot to the table, the Red Boy family is now just about dependent upon the cross.

    You can plug in Eli, Bolio, Dibo....the family of choice. Time waters them all down.

    S
     
    bks, oldguy and DISCOIII like this.
  5. reids skipper

    reids skipper Top Dog

    You mention the brindle ones from red boy stuff slim .... i thought they would mainly come red red nosed Dogs ? .. where there good traits etc more in the brindles and did you favour the brindle ones in the litter ? I did hear that dr d over here could tell the dogs traits etc by the colour they came in the montana dogs he had ( jeep x redboy stuff ) he said the strawberry brindles were always curs ??
     
  6. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    There are no absolutes. But I can say if you pull up the pedigree of Marlowe's Brandy Girl. Look at that picture. I have owned maybe 8 or 9 Red Boy dogs brindled like that. I have been around 6-8 more. I have never seen one quit. I have only seen one or two that had teeth after 20 months. And they throw bulldogs at a high percentage when bred.

    A buddy of mine and I co-own a couple of heavy Mims Red Boy females. When the litters are born we split them down the middle. We take turns with first pick and go until they are done. If there is an odd number of puppies we flip a coin for the last one.

    Believe it or not the brindle ones that pop up go first.

    And I would stand on top of a mountain and scream about how dumb it is to pick a puppy based on color.....but......I'm not the smartest guy either.

    We do not see many red/red noses. Most of my dogs are heavy on the Mims Red Boy and the outs are thru Bolio/Snooty and a shot of Eli. Not that many red noses pop out. I'm not sure why as some of the other strains of Red Boy bring them out a little more often.

    S
     
    bks and reids skipper like this.
  7. reids skipper

    reids skipper Top Dog

    Strange that as you would think dogs heavily inbred on red boy would resemble him ??
     
  8. reids skipper

    reids skipper Top Dog

    Like bingo , peaches , deacon etc ... i know brandy girl was a redboy loposay cross as she was behind peaches the mother to montana etc
     
  9. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    I believe at times we all been guilty of seeing what we want to see in a pedigree, so when I read Joe Montana's production record I mostly only saw Kingfish/Mason's Hog through Shopland's Bash! Champion Hall's Old Swamper sired Shopland's Bash in UK and also CH.Joe jnr's dam (smiley) in the USA.. So my question is this? Take Shopland's Bash (UK) and NKK's Smiley (USA) out of the equation, and did Joe Montana ever produce anything else of note?
     
  10. reids skipper

    reids skipper Top Dog

    Dont think he mated many bitches apart from bash ? ... i did get told that they wanted to use happy eater buy couldn’t so had to use bash instead .. i know montana got mated to scallywags litter sister but without a doubt the best stuff came from the bash matings ...i personally think montanas mother peaches was really well bred and i could never understand why they never inbred on joe with bella etc ... maybe the dr knew why
     
  11. reids skipper

    reids skipper Top Dog

    Oldguy .... is there a link between masons hog and kingfish stuff ?
     
  12. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    reids skipper likes this.
  13. reids skipper

    reids skipper Top Dog

    Was bushea cold oldguy ?
     
  14. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    Kingfish bred by Clyde Mason who also owned Mason's Ch.Hog...Shopland's Bash is 2x Kelly's Spanky, grandson of Noll's King Skipper (litter brother to stubblefield's gr.ch.buddy and adam's ch.candy)
     
    reids skipper likes this.
  15. reids skipper

    reids skipper Top Dog

    Didn’t know that oldguy .... i’d looked but couldn’t find a link between them ...thanks
     
  16. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    If it wasn't for knowing the potence of that Kingfish blood I'd never have mentioned it, since it looks too far back in the pedigree to matter, but I know people who bred litters off Montana and they got nothing, then he got bred to Shopland's Bash and BOOM! Everyone talks Joe Montana and never any mention of Bash, I just don't think they're seeing the whole picture.
     
    reids skipper likes this.
  17. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    Some of the people I spoke to who bred Kingfish dogs crossed them with the Hog blood, also Red Devil, Hetrick, Colby and of course GR.CH.Art.
     
  18. oldguy

    oldguy CH Dog

    @slim12 Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experience of the Redboy dogs, I always appreciate your input, I'll go over your posts again tomorrow with fresh eyes and get back to you.
     
  19. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    True. For what ever reason Brandy Girl came out brindle. It could have been from the Colby pedigree, if there are unknowns in the pedigree or from the Loposay dogs. Some say there is a link between Cotton's Bullet and the Bass Cat and Bass Cleo bitches.

    For me it hard to say where the brindling comes from. And I can say for a lot of years I would look right past a brindle dog as I thought they were just plain ugly. The I had a Bilio/Red Boy/Medlin's Outlaw female that was brindle and white. She grew on me. Then I had Skull for a while and he made me hate them all over again. (He left me and then picked up 4 the hard way, twice over 2 and half hours).

    CH. Charlie (4XW) had a full brother that was brindle, maybe even a better dog, but no teeth to stake a claim.

    So I am not sure where the brindle stuff comes from even when inbred on Red Boy. It pops up on occasion and when it does I latch on if I can.

    I have a male now that is looking for a reason to ruin his teeth. He gives me a sign most every day that today is when I start knocking out my teeth. But then he doesn't. I'm knocking on wood.

    He has a brindle full sister who seems to be holding out too. He has an aunt, that identical to Brandy Girl, that has been toothless from birth. She broke off the puppy teeth doing stupid shit and shaved them off as they grew.

    S
     
    bks and reids skipper like this.
  20. c_note

    c_note CH Dog

    “The” Skull??
     

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