What makes a dog????????

For all ya'll dogmen and women out there, does a pedigree make a true game dog? If you see a dog that you seriously like, that doesn't have a line or papers, would you take the time to find out how well it can do?

 

well with no papers it looks like a long line of accidents

 

No, a pedigree does not make a true game dog. All dog's no matter how pretty their ped's will produce their fair share of curs. Even when you breed honest bulldogs you will get some that don't make the cut. You're second question is kind of broad. Do you mean not having papers on the dog or not knowing how it is bred at all? If i had a dog and did not know how it was bred but i was satisfied with how the dog turned out i would give him a chance to see how he produces.

 

A ped is nothing more than a blueprint of what the dog should be. It wont tell you for sure what the dog will be good dogs are where you find them. I have seen dogs that were bred like a champ but werent much to speak of then I seen dogs that were scatterbred all over the place and would make anyone proud to have on their yard. So if I saw a dog that I was really impressed with then yes I would take a chance.

 

GOOD dogs are where you find them...... I'll FEED any good dog.... Doesn't mean I'll breed him...... or better yet KEEP breeding him.....

 

CRG... the second question shoulda read: if you had a dog, had no idea how it was bred, but it fired into some of your own stuff at an early age and you tried it with success, would you stay with it (breeding wise) or count his w's and say "F**k breeding it"?

 

If the dog was showing well, despite the fact of if you know how its bred or not, if its working for you, why not try breeding it? And if that works well, why stop?

 

I think knowing the ped, or how a dog is bred is important on fairly evaluating the dog in the first place. I wouldn't expect a gyp who has been inbred for several generations to perform like a 3/4 outcross, but she may be a hell of a lot better producer if crossed right.

In my opinion, a breeders main goal is minimizing the "standard deviation" amoung the dogs he produces. Very seldom, do successful breeders breed dogs of unknown lineage, due to so many unknown variables. Most breedings are calculated risks at best, but breeding dogs of unknown lineage, is a shot in the dark. Does it work sometimes? Yep, but why gamble all that time and money on a long shot?

As far as registering dogs, thats the owners preference. I prefer to register my dogs. As long as the pedigree is known registration is of little importance.

 

IMO, It's up to the person with the dog. Not knowing how the dog is bred is going to make the %'s lower producing wise but it's all a crap shoot in the end.

 

If i had the space, time, money, right hair up my ass..... then why not give a shot to a damn nice well bred gyp.... BUT most ppl DOn't want to take that risk or go thru the amount of time it takes to find out, nor spend the money on a bad % wise Bet..... because thats what it is.... a Blind or next to blind gamble.... other than going with something already with Proven stock behind him....... it's allot of work for a very little gain opportunity......

 

So STILLWATER, if you went to a show and this unknown gentleman came with a dog and it displayed all the character traits that you like in a dog, and he wanted you to have it, would you take it even though he knew nothing about it?

 

is it not true that going with a high %age line a crap shot? There are curs born in every litter, who can determine the outcome of any one breeding or for that matter line? Does buying a dog str8 from TG mean that im gonna have a dog that produces as well as Frisco or Chinaman?

 

then go out and wasit your time and money.... and try your luck on a shot in the dark like Stillwater said

 

I don't even own a dog that has "ALL the character traits" I like in a dog so yes I would take it, and evaluate it further over a period of time. I wouldn't breed it, but I may try to find out what it was out of so I could breed to that.
I don't understand WHY everyone is so interested in breeding to a "good" dog, I had rather breed to the Stud and bitch the "good" dog is out of. Does that make sense??
It could be a grade A dog, but out of two maneaters. He may not exhibit this trait, but he may reproduce it readily. If I breed to dogs, that I KNOW there are no maneaters, and/or human aggressive dogs in that dogs lineage, then I have an understanding of what to expect as far as temperment and other traits, with a dog of unknown lineage, I have absolutly no idea what to expect.

 

Im asking these questions b/c my friend and I have been arguing about his dogs. Hes building off a dog that he got from his Uncle thats heavy into dogs but they dont know what the dog is. The litter that hes building from is from an unkown male and a know proven gyp. Ive got a cold male that I got from a friend that I know has ped, which has a litter on the ground now thats looking and acting very nice, which he says is a waste of dog food b/c the stud is cold. Does the stud being cold garauntee the pups wont do well?

 

No, it does not mean the pups will not do well. IMO just makes the %'s lower because you don't know what you will get from the stud. Nothing's a sure shot in breeding. All you can do is set the %'s in you're favor.

 

their are ROM/POR dogs that were cold as Ice, nothing wrong with breeding a cold dog as it never quit

Little Gator is one of them

in your friends case, I'd use that dog as a show dog rather then a stud dog, if I had room to raise and cull through an entire litter that may not have one show dog out of it then I'd breed it and see what comes of it but limited space is for high percentage brood dogs with proven lineage, I'm not into wasting space and time on a crap shoot

"The test of a dog is the show - The test of a family is time" (Bert S.)

 

Nothing is garaunteed.

I say to each his own. Its your dogs so its ultimatly up to you, but I wouldn't expect to many folks to tell you, that its the right thing to do.

I wouldn't breed them. Hell, I have dogs on my yard I consider good dogs, but I ain't going to breed them, because I don't consider them brood stock, and not really interested in finding out, as long as I have others I know are good producers. Its hard enough to compete, breeding dogs you know are good producers, much less ones you don't have a clue about.

 

Well, first of all, A pedigree is nothing more than a family tree for people. It is one in the same, it tells the ancestry of the dog. It tells who was what before him.her and what they did. Not what this dog IS or CAN DO, only the dog can tell you that. Just like in families of anything else, there are some good and some bad.
Papers do not make the dog, the dog makes the papers. It can either prove its worthiness or not. But then, there you have it again, it can not legitimately be proven anyhow. Proving your dogs by the only they were ever tested (in the pit) is no longer legal. So, I have to ask; "How well it can how"?

 

A dog can show itself in its offspring. Not always does it have to be taken to the pits. Does all brood stock go to the pits? but you still use them for breeding right? True enough you know what you have based on the info give at the time of purchase, but you still breed it despite knowing if it is proven or not?