Dog Food

Ok I've gone thru the health and nutrition thread, and I see a split between kibble and raw food. Now my question is, is kibble that bad for your dog? Raw diet seems like more of a hassle. Ive always fed kibble. What are the major risks for kibble or should I stick with what works

 

Lots of people use kibble. Just find one without fillers in it like soy corn and so on. Grain free is what i recommend. Also find one with atleast a 4 star rating on uo to 6 star. About twice a week you can gie hem some real chicken and substiute tha way. Thats how i feed my pups. They are healthy as can be.

 

raw is the best way to feed, but no kibble is not that bad for most dogs. my dog had an allergy to I am guessing the preservative used in all kibbles since he loses weight on every kind of kibble I have tried and I have tried MANY different types of grain free, and even some with grain in hopes he wouldn't lose weight. It was either the kibble or his thyroid and thank goodness it was the kibble. That said, Raw does take some work and if your not going to put in the work and your dog does well on kibble then there is no reason switching. Raw can be very cheap depending on how you feed it, there are some forms of raw that cost like .20 a day or something crazy, I feed mostly wild game right now and so I think I am spending a total of about $20 a month, but come spring it will be close to 100 or so a month since the game will be gone by then.

 

Whats Really in Pet Food Nutrition-Related Diseases

The idea that one pet food provides all the nutrition a companion animal will ever need for its entire life is a dangerous myth.

Today, the diets of cats and dogs are a far cry from the variable meat-based diets that their ancestors ate. The unpleasant results of grain-based, processed, year-in and year-out diets are common. Health problems associated with diet include:

Urinary tract disease. Plugs, crystals, and stones are more common in cats eating dry diets, due to the chronic dehydration and highly concentrated urine they cause. “Struvite” stones used to be the most common type in cats, but another more dangerous type, calcium oxalate, has increased and is now tied with struvite. Manipulation of manufactured cat food formulas to increase the acidity of urine has caused the switch. Dogs can also form stones as a result of their diet.
Kidney disease. Chronic dehydration associated with dry diets may also be a contributing factor in the development of kidney disease and chronic renal failure in older cats. Cats have a low thirst drive; in the wild they would get most of their water from their prey. Cats eating dry food do not drink enough water to make up for the lack of moisture in the food. Cats on dry food diets drink more water, but the total water intake of a cat eating canned food is twice as great.7
Dental disease. Contrary to the myth propagated by pet food companies, dry food is not good for teeth.8 Given that the vast majority of pets eat dry food, yet the most common health problem in pets is dental disease, this should be obvious. Humans do not floss with crackers, and dry food does not clean the teeth.
Obesity. Feeding recommendations or instructions on the packaging are sometimes inflated so that the consumer will end up feeding — and purchasing — more food. One of the most common health problems in pets, obesity, may also be related to high-carb, high-calorie dry foods. Both dogs and cats respond to low-carb wet food diets. Overweight pets are more prone to arthritis, heart disease, and diabetes. Dry cat food is now considered the cause of feline diabetes; prevention and treatment include switching to a high protein, high moisture, low-carb diet.
Chronic digestive problems. Chronic vomiting, diarrhea, constipation, and inflammatory bowel disease are among the most frequent illnesses treated. These are often the result of an allergy or intolerance to pet food ingredients. The market for “limited antigen” or “novel protein” diets is now a multi-million dollar business. These diets were formulated to address the increasing intolerance to commercial foods that pets have developed. Even so, an animal that tends to develop allergies can develop allergies to the new ingredients, too. One twist is the truly “hypoallergenic” food that has had all its proteins artificially chopped into pieces smaller than can be recognized and reacted to by the immune system. Yet there are documented cases of animals becoming allergic to this food, too. It is important to change brands, flavors, and protein sources every few months to prevent problems.
Bloat. Feeding only one meal per day can cause the irritation of the esophagus by stomach acid, and appears to be associated with gastric dilitation and volvulus (canine bloat). Feeding two or more smaller meals is better.
Heart disease. An often-fatal heart disease in cats and some dogs is now known to be caused by a deficiency of the amino acid taurine. Blindness is another symptom of taurine deficiency. This deficiency was due to inadequate amounts of taurine in cat food formulas, which in turn had occurred due to decreased amounts of animal proteins and increased reliance on carbohydrates. Cat foods are now supplemented with taurine. New research suggests that some dog breeds are susceptible to the same condition. Supplementing taurine may also be helpful for dogs, but as yet few manufacturers are adding extra taurine to dog food.
Hyperthyroidism. There is also evidence that hyperthyroidism in cats may be related to diet. This is a relatively new disease that first surfaced in the 1970s. Some experts theorize that excess iodine in commercial cat food is a factor. New research also points to a link between the disease and pop-top cans, and flavors including fish or “giblets.” This is a serious disease, and treatment is expensive.
Many nutritional problems appeared with the popularity of cereal-based commercial pet foods. Some have occurred because the diet was incomplete. Although several ingredients are now supplemented, we do not know what ingredients future researchers may discover that should have been supplemented in pet foods all along. Other problems may occur from reactions to additives. Others are a result of contamination with bacteria, mold, drugs, or other toxins. In some diseases the role of commercial pet food is understood; in others, it is not. The bottom line is that diets composed primarily of low quality cereals and rendered meals are not as nutritious or safe as you should expect for your cat or dog.

 

Raw is by far best in my opinion,it's the most cost effective way to give your dogs a very good diet.You can buy pretty good kibble but all the high end stuff is going to really cost you and even then it will still just be really good kibble. Raw is a bit of a hassle but dogs are a hassle anyway,plus paying a dollar plus per pound for dog feed is a hassle to me. But yeah,dogs can and have lived off of store bought dog feed for a long time and will continue to do so,some dogs seem to do better with it than others.Some do have food allergies. To me the biggest risk is when one of these stupid dog food companies have a problem in the manufacturing process and a few dogs die as a result before the word is out about a recall.It's happened a few times and with different brands of food. Raw is best but lots of dogs get by with the other,if you don't want to mess with feeding raw.

 

great info Capo

here is what a 4 year old dog's teeth look like on raw (been on raw for around 11 months now) just so you can see what a difference it is to a kibble fed dog

 

.......... Exactly, trial and error, find out what suits you and your hound and work with them! Practice makes Perfect!!!!

 

ok well this leads me to my second question. A raw diet consist of what? Do you thaw out raw chicken everyday? What about puppies? Is there a recipe for a raw diet. I am just a little weary of feeding a pup raw chicken. do you break it down, or feed it whole. I have a good friend who is a vet tech, and he feeds science diet. How does this compare?

 

so after doing some youtube video watching, i saw a bunch of people buying a bag of leg quarters, or chicken necks from the meat market. So if I have a 6-8wk old pup, he is still able to go on the rawa food diet. So feeding leg quarters or chicken necks will do the trick. do i need to add anything else to the raw chicken

 

thanks for the link slim

 

really depends on what kinda raw you want to do, BARF is raw with veggies, what I feed is Prey Model Raw (PMR) its 80% meat 10% organ 10% bone (after transition) the ratios very depending on the dog, Goren is probably closer to 85% meat 5% bone 10% organ, you need to have veriety in the meat (after transition) to get a balanced diet, I feed currently, mostly venison, some fish once or twice a week, some pork, chicken, beef, a few eggs with shell a week, goat and rabbit when I can get it.

this is how you transition and just in general about PMR
How to Get Started | Prey Model Raw

something that most people wouldn't know, in general, when you switch to raw, expect a dog (adult, not puppy) to lose some weight, typically enough to notice, and expect a time where the coat looks like shit because the dog is going through detox, a puppy that has not been on kibble for very long (I think up to about 8 or so months) really doesn't have a detox period though. and GO SLOW with transition, its hard to me to think of being patient because I want things done right then and there but this is something you have to wait on the dog to show signs that its ready to move on (the poop doesn't lie)

 

ok here is another question I came across. If you are feeding a kibble, do you add anything else to supplement nutrients and minerals. If feeding a kibble, whats something good to add to the meal for the dog

 

most people that add anything add fish oil, if you have a high quality kibble that is pretty much all you would need to add because the kibble should have all the vitamins you need, you could add a joint supplement or just feed a chicken foot a day as a treat (I found it works much better than any supplement I have tried for my boy)

 

Plain yogurt

 

This site has helped me out a lot starting on raw.

Domain Names, Web Hosting and Online Marketing Services | Network Solutions

 

VERY GOOD write up...I agree with a lot of what he wrote, but I do still do some things a lil dif besides what he wrote!

 

General rule, raw is always best
if you cant get raw or cant afford raw, grain-free is second best (try and aim for grain free foods that have meats like duck, venison, lamb, whatever, a lot of dogs are allergic to chicken)
raw is awesome for clean teeth and is digested extremely well, kibble is not digested as well and can sometimes lead to plaque buildup on teeth, but is generally healthy if you go grain-free