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Gr ch mayday look rare?

Discussion in 'Dog Discussion' started by ZeboCloneDNA, Nov 20, 2019.

  1. GrChHaunch

    GrChHaunch Top Dog

    EQ for short was of course originally designed for horses but it is popular with all sorts of athletes. Decent strength gains with few side effects but in older guys it elevate hematocrit. Of course Hem can be lowered through blood donations.
     
  2. GrChHaunch

    GrChHaunch Top Dog


    Ped's are involved in all sports, I've run programs for baseball players et al, those guys have the big money.l. The key is to keep kids away from them as they will stop the natural development of the endocrine system which does not fully mature until 27. 21 year olds are chock full of their own hormones anyways....now if they are looking at a multi million $ NFL contract.

    DC's struggle has always been with making weight, in fact he has damaged his kidneys on several occasions cutting down, he just struggles getting his body fat down.

    I can tell you as a wrestler that his technique is absolutely fantastic, he is an absolute master of the mat. With his kidneys I would strongly recommend against gear as it can impact the kidneys and he would be a smallish heavyweight anyways.
     
  3. GrChHaunch

    GrChHaunch Top Dog


    It is true he lower weights are more competitive and exciting. Personally, I really only spend money to watch the women fight anymore. Zhang Weili vs Thug Rose was one of the most entertaining fights ever....talk about heart and yes, gameness.
     
  4. Ssdd

    Ssdd CH Dog

    Lawler Mcdonald 2 was the most entertaining fight ever but I won't split hairs

    Lawler vs Mcdonald 2 was the best ufc fight hands down. That was 2 game motherfuckers willing to die til Mcdonald pulled up. Jmo
     
  5. che

    che Top Dog

    Many users spend more time using than they did researching. They do not replace hard work but they do make the body recover much faster so that you can work as hard or harder much sooner. I think people who use steroid on dogs have more complicated dog keep periode than non users. The reason of any steroid or similar compound is to get your dog beyond 100% of its genetic potential. That’s a thing but it’s actually harder to make it click. If you have it done right on the right dogYou can make him keep going long enough his maximum potential to outlast a good naturally trained dog. In short term you can benefit from
    it if you do it right. In long term, that’s harder stuff But you can still benefit from it. If you are expertise on how to use. First you need to have something to begin with it and that’s a good healtyh dog with great heart. Nothing gonna make the have more off something it just don’t have to start with it. I know few guys who are really good at using it on dogs. But that’s just few guys and I know more than few doggers
     
  6. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Equipoise is a pretty good one to use as it does not tend to build mass and works while cutting. I had a friend who used it himself for a number of years. He was cock diesel strong and won a bunch of trophies power lifting. The kicker is we just about had to move the mail box to the porch because he could barely walk to the end of the drive way without blowing hard. He powerlifted but he did cut cycles in the summer for shirts off at the beach.

    He had a friend that weight pulled dogs with a few American Staffordshire Terriers. Those dogs were big and powerful and very competitive. For them hitting the target was a lot easier because it was a couple pulls at lesser weights to get to a max pull but there is tons of time in between for recovery. That is similar to human athletes when there is times or distances that can factor as part of recovery.

    S





     
  7. che

    che Top Dog

    One off the most used drug on dog is Erytropoëtine(epo) over here.
     
    ben brockton likes this.
  8. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Agreed. And a hundred years ago when I was riding up and down the road like a crazy person I always looked forward to competing with the camps that used. I am math guy who really likes odds and percentages. The steroids seldom, if ever, fall in the middle. It is either knocked out of the park or it is a swing and a miss. That gives me a fifty-fifty shot before we ever leave home. Then. I know bulldoggers and I know they are (sorry for clumping us together) all chasing that ace and will do just about anything to get to ACE status. With that in mind at least 75% will leap before they think. So with steroids I moved from a 50-50 shot to having a 75% chance to win and I have never left the house.

    I had friend that tried them with another set of his friends. They had a connection that even allowed them to do weekly bloodwork. They set their cycles on blood chemistry very similarly to very wealthy pro athletes. These guys started off with really good dogs and my personal opinion was their win percentage would have been better if they had went all natural but you can't chase the dream being slow and steady and all natural (most can;t anyway, as they are looking for the easier path). So these guys started with good dogs, had a plan, used all the information and experience available to them and could not consistently hit it out of the park. They would have freak athletes blow hot in 10-12 minutes and never be able to catch up from what was delivered in their 'hot time'.

    At best 1 of 3, maybe even 1 of 4 knock it out of the park. So even the guys with knowledge and doing things at a high level are only at a 25% to 33% success rate. With some loose math I end up somewhere between a 66% and a 75% chance to win before I ever leave home knowing regardless of the quality or talent of my dog if he will compete for 20 minutes I am 3/4's there and only have to compete with the 25% remaining.

    With that said. I have seen where that 25% kick the world square in the ass when the ball is hit out of the park. And when that happens not only is it a beautiful thing but it is a wonder to see.

    The subject then gets deeper. If they knock it out of the park in their last one with said dog the odds are even further diminished in trying to do it two times in a row.

    Maybe the biggest part is that I do not have faith in my fellow doggers to do things right all the time.

    Sorry for babbling. On call and can't really go or do anything while I wait by the phone.

    S








     
  9. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    EPO is good stuff. It may be a tad bit easier to hit target but you have to be really careful with strength work.

    It has been used around here a couple-three times and I am a carpet mill guy at heart and a dog can mass up pretty quick.

    These dogs are naturally strong and naturally muscular. We normally switch to a feed keep with supplements so we are fueling and even over fueling the body. Most of those supplements are pissed out (I have read as much as 50-60%).

    With EPO in a dog that is working really hard the extra red blood cells allow the body to carry more to the muscle so it is a much better assimilation rate on said supplements. The dog tends to 'grow in mass' as their body naturally tends to do that without the extras. A bulldog who is fed a normal decent food and walked a few miles a day is an impressive specimen to see. Then add hard work and even more getting to the muscle.

    The conditioner who relies on the free spinning slat mill (example: Armstrong, cyclists, and the Tour de france) get the better results with EPO.

    It can get a dog to go all out for longer periods of time. If the keep program is tailored to recovery and the EPO is stretching the work times, that too becomes a hard task to handle.

    S




     
    che likes this.
  10. che

    che Top Dog

    @slim12 Thanks for babbling. I agree with all above. There so much truth to this! It took me forever to learn…
    Maybe the biggest part is that I do not have faith in my fellow doggers to do things right all the time.

    thats the issue. I agree with you …
     
  11. ben brockton

    ben brockton CH Dog

    That and anovar is really the standard of modern times. The only others like dex or cortif are and should be only used after a car wreck. Anabolic is fucking retarded and will do more harm then good. Folks talking crazy about using it for recovery is just nonsense. You need rest and a variable work load not bulking up one. There is no benefit to running hot and killing the testosterone production.
     
    che likes this.
  12. che

    che Top Dog

    Yes rest or food they are most overlooked .and yet most important. Anavar And epo both in combination have given good results overhere
     
  13. GrChHaunch

    GrChHaunch Top Dog


    All very interesting. I know nothing about conditioning dogs for matches, I just run mine on the bike, play catch (if possible) and work on tug rope....just enough to get them to be reasonable house dogs.

    In humans, Anavar, or Var for short, is an absolutely excellent drug, good results with minimal side effects. It is often fake however, often wintsrol, which can wreak havoc upon your lipids. You also need a good amount of var, 60 mgs or so to see good results, and then the reults are impressive, And it can be expensive. The Mexican kennels I know use gear. EQ, EPO, and var, however are not going to give your dog aggression like testosterone of some Halotestin will. Test is going to increase weight, but Halo will not. Halo is toxic and expensive. In fighters I only use it in the last portion of their training. For BJJ guys I usually don't recommend it as it can cause over aggression and mistakes, which are magnified when the Gi is involved.

    But for a striker it really amps them up, like I said Mike Tyson loved it. I used a little when I fought in NAGA which was gi-less. I no longer have the vid, but I was pacing back and forth at beginning of a match like a caged animal. I also refused to tap to a submission and got my leg broken but kept on fighting. The key to Halo is to only use it the last couple weeks of prep. It can make you a savage.

    It is interesting that dogs were getting lab work. I make all my guys get lab work, you have to monitor what is going on inside your body. In regards to rest, I believe in maximal training intensity, but also complete days off with no training whatsoever. Sometimes you are better taking every third day off completely, as opposed to the old school strategy of only 1 day off per week. I don't use de-loading whatsoever.
     
  14. che

    che Top Dog

    Its not that uncommon, everyone is looking for a way to catch their win and getter better.
     
  15. GrChHaunch

    GrChHaunch Top Dog

    Here is the thing..it is true in humans, and probably in dogs: Gear is a tool. It won't automatically make you a champion. The bottom line is you have to do the work. In a sport like wrestling you can overcome a lot through insane hard work.

    Now in bodybuilding, genetics are king. No one worked harder than me, and I did just as much gear as anyone else but I simply did not have the genetics to get my pro card.
     
  16. che

    che Top Dog

    Nothing gonna make the have more off something it just don’t have to start with it.
     
    GrChHaunch likes this.
  17. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    All well said. The idea or maybe the ideal of steroids is the ability to recover moreso that to build (their original intent, much like every other drug....the side effects of one drug may be the actual answer to another issue. No one ever said let's create viagara for an extended erection {mentioned on another post so I threw it back in} it was a side effect of another study altogether.

    There is an old adage from the eastern Europeans in the 60's and 70's, especially the East Germans. "50% reduction in recovery equals a 10% increase in work which leads to a 50% increase in recovery. Before performance can be increased the recovery must be decreased". We all pretty much do this anyway but they laid the ground work for performance enhancing drugs and were the first to really knock it out of the park on an international level.

    It is all about recovery not about work. (in a sense) {and just for numbers sake as an explanation-nothing real or implied} If a dog can run the mill for ten minutes all out and then takes two minutes to recover naturally when he is on the juice he can run that same ten minutes and recover in one minute. On average your work load can go up as much as ten percent for every 50% reduction in recovery. (Why you can't go from benching 200 this week, take one 30 day cycle and then bench 500). So if the dog ran for ten minutes and cut his two minute recovery time to one minute he can then run the mill for 11 minutes and his recovery time will increase by 50% to 1:30 seconds. Then as the steroids start aiding that recovery that recovery drops to 45 seconds and the work increases by 10% to 12.1 minutes. The recovery makes a slight increase and the steroids take effect and it is decreased. Then from there the work increases. The gains are incredible in comparison to natural in both dogs and humans.

    I have tried it a couple times and once I knocked it out of the park and once I should have just saved a good dog and sent my money by mail. I use the same principles when working dogs but am OK with the natural results. I do believe the gas is beneficial but I have yet to see consistent control. The camp that nails that down will pretty much be walking on water.

    S
     
    che likes this.
  18. GrChHaunch

    GrChHaunch Top Dog


    You are absolutely correct about the importance of recovery... that is a critical concept in bodybuilding and we saw its importance as far back as Mike Mentzer and then taking the concept too its peak by Dorian Yates (the GOAT, IMO). Dorian was legendary for his training intensity, but would only do (after warming up) 2 all out sets for a particular exercise, totally different from the high volume programs of Arnold's day. And then he would take the next day off completely. Very different from de-loading strategies that focused upon low intensity "recovery" workouts. I always found modified versions of Dorians approached worked best for me and my clients, although the sweet spot for me was always 3 working sets. Still less than others who would regularly do 4 or 5. In some situations, like a gal I am prepping today we might do higher volume on her legs curls and squats, but pretty much everything else is on a 3 set scheme.

    Interesting, I adapted my first MMA training program based upon a dog conditioning program where work load was cut literally in half 7 days out. So 3 hours of training became 1.5 (still high intensity) which went all the way down to a brisk 45 minute workout on Wednesday (agains very high intensity, but we would be extremely careful to avoid injury) and then a 30 minute workout Thursday and a complete day off before fight day.

    This was in the face of guys who would still be training all out for hours everyday the week before a fight, a problem that was much worse 25 years ago. We would also spar hard the week before the fight, going 10-15 rounds all out up to Wednesday and then substantial road work Thursday. The D'Amatto guys were notorious for lots of sparring (and maybe this is why Mike peaked at 19...actually he was never the same after Cus died). My first BJJ coach (Nick Sanzo) would be doing push ups in this hotel Friday night before he fought in an early UFC. Experience, and science have shown us the error of our ways, but the mentality was different back then too, you were considered weak if you backed off. Interestingly, The Thais figured this out long ago without scientific backing.
     
  19. GrChHaunch

    GrChHaunch Top Dog

    Exactly. Insane drive, work ethic, and genetics...there are no pills or shots for that. I was always willing to die to win, and low and behold I did die twice 10 weeks ago and am now a heart patient. I had to have a cardiac ablation procedure on my heart 2 days ago....and I will be back in the gym anyway. :))
     
  20. slim12

    slim12 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Like great conversation... I don't think Mike peeked at 19 but I think he definitely lost his direction. If ever there was a fighter that had the life style of a bulldog it was Mike with Cus. He found him as a pup, raised him the way he wanted a fighter to be raised, he caged him so the neighbor's poodle down the road didn't get hurt, he unleashed on the public every 10-12 weeks. Two things I think are for sure, but it is all debate and speculation....One, if Cus had lived another fifteen or so years and 2. Mike allowed that control as an adult. He would be the greatest sports person of all time. He would be 60 or more and 0. His knockout percentage would be off the charts. A 19-20 year old Mike Tyson hit like a monster but his best attribute is he did not get hit. Damn near a 220lb version of Floyd Mayweather Jr. except when someone missed they got a tad bit more than a Mayweather love tap. The movement stopped after Cus when he was dependent upon Pookie and Ray-Ray for guidance in training and Don King in charge of finances. He became a shell of Iron Mike.


    But back to the topic. I don't change anything until I adjust my feed cycle. I count backwards between 24 and 30 hours from show time for five days. When feed schedule is adjusted to show night/weight dial. I get him out and about and let him walk and piss and what not, if he is really high strung we may sprint the mill a couple times just to say we did something.

    S
     

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