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Bulldogs in Japan.

Discussion in 'Dog Discussion' started by Wally123, Nov 9, 2015.

  1. GK1

    GK1 Big Dog

    Perhaps. The Tosa is an enormous mastiff. How much relative athleticism, agility, speed, endurance and heat dissipation can it genetically possess in comparison to a <50lb game dog? I just can't see the efficiency in such a massive animal.

    Certainly a noble breed I'm sure the Japanese are proud of. Bear stopper.

    http://www.bushidotosainu.com
     
  2. bluedoglover

    bluedoglover Top Dog

    from what i know the rules are :

    The rules for Tosa dog fighting are not simply the dog that bites is the winner and the dog that is bitten is the loser. The dog that howls or runs away is the loser. Victory is given to the dog that does not lose its fighting spirit to the end of the match. The dog who loses notices that he has lost when he leaves the ring first and sees that his master is sad. The dog who wins notices that his has won from his master and the people around him seem happy. In this match, Shokiryu barked during the match and Hibiki won. The younger dogs learn the rules like this.


    no lots of blood
    no scratch line
    most don't go over 25 minutes, i believe the limit may be 30(?)
     
  3. AGK

    AGK Super duper pooper scooper Administrator

    If tosa were the better fighting dog they would be much more widely used, not the APBT. 2 totally different sets of rules for their matches. Under cajun rules many of those dogs would cur. I'm not saying that here and there they wouldn't win against the APBT, of course they would they are 2 to 3 x larger in size however, let one of those big curs get stretched out to the 25 to 35 minute mark and I bet most every one will quit or be dismantled once it gases out.... There's a reason weight classes are used. Pound for pound there is no other dog on the planet as good in the box as a good bulldog is. Been proven since the breeds creation time and time again....
     
  4. c_note

    c_note CH Dog

    Those are big animals!! I've seen one in person. Gave the impression I could ride on his back. Seriously. The females are about the size of an AB. The males range from 90-180+. How long would it take a big combat dog to overpower a smaller combat dog? Depends on the dogs. I'm not sure how hard they bite. The damage of a dog after a fight isn't that bad. There was a site that had "medium" Tosa's and lots of info. If I find it I will post
     
  5. c_note

    c_note CH Dog

    I agree. That's why they imported bulldogs! I'm sure they saw what you described. Also I'm sure they saw what a few good bulldogs go to waste! You can bet they, not all, use APBT in their breeding programs
     
  6. Wally123

    Wally123 Big Dog

    Of course p4p there's no comparison but facts are Tosa's are the much bigger dog, a Bulldog surviving 30 mins with one is no mean feat at all. Every roll I've seen between the breeds the Tosa has dominated the APBT with ease. I've read occasionally a catch weight Bulldog will defeat a lightweight Tosa but that is an exception and not the norm.
     
  7. bluedoglover

    bluedoglover Top Dog

    every roll? it's pretty rare, and considering current records what you saw is even rarer. i've never even heard of a tosa winning over a bulldog, though i'm sure it happens.
    not very hard. to them it's more about wrestling. if they went up against a bone crusher, they'd cur. and a gut or stifle dog would be out of their reach. a dog that goes under the chin would ruin them. they could beat a head dog or perhaps a leg dog.
     
  8. Wally123

    Wally123 Big Dog

    Yeah I've seen a few rolls between the two breeds, some in Europe and some in Japan. The Tosa dominated the Bulldog in every bout barring one, a good Tosa in Europe was fought to a stand still but it was a youngster and later when on to kill a few Bulldogs. Some of its matches can be seen on the web.
     
  9. bluedoglover

    bluedoglover Top Dog

    can you pm me about it?
     
  10. Wally123

    Wally123 Big Dog

    Yeah pal, ask away.
     
  11. bluedoglover

    bluedoglover Top Dog

    can you send me a message?
     
  12. TROTLINE

    TROTLINE Top Dog

    Very good post everybody I have heard of those for years! I thought they kind of lost it along with the traditional Samurai! Been up all night reading about them! LOL
     
  13. Wally123

    Wally123 Big Dog

    Can't message you your inbox is full.
     
  14. bluedoglover

    bluedoglover Top Dog

    okay, i'll clear it.
     
  15. c_note

    c_note CH Dog

    No sir. I love pitbulldogs as much as most of you guys and FOR DAMN SURE MORE THAN MOST! Truth is, that's a big fuckin dog... I don't think you understand. If your bulldog makes it 30 minutes with a medium to large tosa, great! Bulldogs are more devastating because they are bred that way. Different rules, different styles called for. Getting a 180lb+ dog to fight SILENTLY for 30 minutes or so ain't no punk. They have time limits I believe. I wouldn't put a Gr Ch against a tosa of same quality! Refer to AGK weight comment! Imagine Floyd Maywether v Vladimir Klitchko... Or GGG against Vitali... Waste of time for both, as I'm sure there is better and more reasonable comp at their own weight
     
  16. bluedoglover

    bluedoglover Top Dog

    ok so that must mean lehri is gamer than gr ch buck? buck was screaming out of frustration when sandman got hold of hiim and he couldn't get him. my friend's bull terrier has gone silently for 25+ minutes with APBT. and both dogs were covered in blood. but after a tosa fight, you don't see too much blood. 土ä½çŠ¬ã®æˆ¦ã„ - Google Search
    look at this. my heeler mix has drawn more blood than half of this dogs in a quick scrap with a labrador!!!

    compare to ch thunder.
    http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/pictures/192092.jpg

    tosas have size, but they don't have mouth. it doesn't matter how big you are when you've got barely any mouth and there's a smaller dog underneath you, taking chunks out of you! there's plenty of images of tosas getting under other tosas. imagine a bulldog. if it were a gut or stifle dog, AND a harder biter? tosa's out classed unless it's dealing with small dog or a head dog. but a catchweight dog? i'm backing APBT. not to mention the time LIMIT is 35. and curs are allowed to go again. but let's not turn this into APBT vs tosa yet AGAIN.
     
  17. Wally123

    Wally123 Big Dog

    They've got enough mouth to defeat Bulldogs in most videos I've seen. I've only seen one clip of a Bulldog beating a Tosa and that was when a European dog called Chico was a juvenile, Chico later went on to kill a few Bulldogs. His father was Tano and that lost in 1:12 against a catchweight Bulldog called Gr Ch Tito.

    Don't forget these were European Tosa's as well, admittedly they looked the real deal, not these fat ear suckers you mostly see on the net. I also think Tano fought against Tito using Cajun rules, an impressive feat going against a killer of a Bulldog. I also read he dominated Tito throughout the match and injured himself gravely by smashing his head on some concrete whilst shaking Tito.
     
  18. bluedoglover

    bluedoglover Top Dog

    i heard tito pulled through because of his gameness and beat him.but tank hit head on the pit wall and died after the match. and tito was only like 62 pound right? that's in the normal range to me. a bit big, but still normal. i've also heard of chico, and i'd love to hear more.
     
  19. bamaman

    bamaman GRCH Dog

    I don't doubt you have saw videos of what you claim.I question the quality of APBT you have saw I seriously doubt they were of any real quality just wound up a bait dog for a 150 LB mut.
     
  20. Wally123

    Wally123 Big Dog

    That's the million dollar question isn't, tbh the same could be said of the Tosa's in these fights too. Don't forget most the clips I've seen are European dogs in places like Serbia and Romania, can't see them having top quality Tosa's tbh.

    I'm a massive APBT fan and what shocked and surprised me is how easy they handled Bulldogs in these rolls and how keen they were to fight. I got brought up reading Stratton's books who made out as though a 30lb Bulldog would be too quick and too powerful for a dog that wouldn't be keen on fighting and would be super defensive. That ain't true from what I've seen. In my head the APBT was king regardless of size but that isn't the case.
     

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