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Old Family Red

Discussion in 'APBT Bloodlines' started by Del Castillo PR, Apr 12, 2012.

  1. CrazyHorse

    CrazyHorse Big Dog

    Just eyeballing the ped with out really breaking down the ped I would say atleast 70% and could possibly be closer to 75%! The % I came up with is the breakdown of Koehler's Bull pedigree.
  2. bamaman

    bamaman GRCH Dog

    Crazy Horse ..You the man as always bro..I respect your opinion.
  3. bamaman

    bamaman GRCH Dog

    Ok CH what about Bolio?after Tombstone?
  4. mccoypitbulls

    mccoypitbulls Underdog

    Good ones.that's ur shit yall?
  5. CrazyHorse

    CrazyHorse Big Dog

    Bolio who is Bull's half brother/uncle also carries about 70% OFRN blood. Tombstone who I believe is a brother/sister breeding especially after hearing Maloney admit to it on a taped telephone conversation is about 62% OFRN.
  6. stickler

    stickler Banned

    It's not that much OFRN.
    Call it OF (or OFR) and you're right.
  7. afb263

    afb263 Premium Member Premium Member

    Would you consider a tight bred clouse dog OFRN.
  8. bamaman

    bamaman GRCH Dog

    Look at Fitzwaters Goldie who was the sire to Zeke and Zeke is the sire of Koehlers Bull and Bolio...Ok so Fitzwaters Goldie was 75 percent Lightner and 25 percent Colby.So yeah id say Zeke had alot of ofrn in him and he passed that down to Bolio and Bull.I havent studied all Clouse dogs so I dont know how they are all bred.But if they are bred like Zeke yeah them dogs had alot of ofrn in them.CH could prob answer that one better than me.
  9. stickler

    stickler Banned

    Would you consider a tight bred clouse dog OFRN.

  10. stickler

    stickler Banned

  11. bamaman

    bamaman GRCH Dog

    afb ill give u some insight..Do your own study and never rely on just one persons opinion..Develop your own thru study.Thats the best way to go about it.I have my own opinions thru what I study so i dont listen to squat from someone else..I may listen buut doesnt mean ill agree.
  12. stickler

    stickler Banned

    And is it your own opinion that Old Family Red (topic) and OFRN means one and the same thing ?
    Your study may lack a few points.
  13. TDK

    TDK CH Dog Staff Member

    Howard Heinzl once said: "If ya go back far enough, me and Indian Sonny are related." Catch his point?
  14. corvettedex

    corvettedex CH Dog Premium Member

    LMFAO.......So True........
  15. stickler

    stickler Banned

    Damn, I was almost hollering for your help here and did expect to see a little bit more from you about this topic.
    And now you come in here with just a short reply.
    And as always, you are right on point.
  16. TDK

    TDK CH Dog Staff Member

    HAHA TY, Stickler. I was hoping for a "less is more" effect. LOL
  17. CrazyHorse

    CrazyHorse Big Dog

    This is the biggest misconception concerning OFR and OFRN! OFR were EXTINCT when Feeley, Corcoran, Williams, Lightner were breeding dogs. Notice I didn't mention Hemphill, Wilder or Wallace because the misconception concerning OFRN is that they were the only OFRN breeders!

    I'll throw out an example of what many consider an OFRN dog.

    Reckless Red when you start breaking down his ped actually has less OFRN blood than this dog.

    People that don't know or how to read a pedigree can't see that Sambo is an OFRN dog and a very high % OFRN dog. Don't get it twisted even without Hemphil's Vickey Goldie is a 75% OFRN dog.

    Ch Slasher is a higher % OFRN dog than Wilder's Reckless Red! OFRN breeders could have bred to Ch Slasher because after Maloney sold him to his new owner in Florida Slasher was advertised in the 1976 Gazette at stud for $200!

    Bolio has more OFRN blood than this dog that is considered an OFRN dog.

    Black Widow with a black coat and nose has more OFRN than this dog.

    Legacy is the heaviest Hemphill/Wilder dog left on the planet and she's not heavier than Black Widow!
  18. TDK

    TDK CH Dog Staff Member

    Widow was only ONE QUARTER Dibo. The rest was Jack Williams. People key on dogs which are less influential in the breeding than others for some reason.
  19. bamaman

    bamaman GRCH Dog

    Good post Crazy Horse..enjoyed it.
  20. stickler

    stickler Banned

    OFRN starts here:


    A well known example of a 'true' OFRN:


    I still believe that in the beginning there was the OF-dogs (maybe of all colors, maybe only pure reds, I'm still not sure yet).
    Then a sub strain of pure red noses was build up or just popped up (?). The OFR's. Even if IM claims they were only red from the very beginning. And he should know better as I do.
    But sheet, I still can't agree witout any proof.
    The OFRN's didn't start with the term OFRN, it was just a try, by a few people, to preserve the OFR's.
    They were lucky and found 6 dogs. Unfortunaly all males. Too bad !
    The next step was to select the best bitches that were the closest thing to those OFR's. To keep it at least as close as possible to the true bred OFR's. Well, J.P. got it, of course. Crossed, but tight bred through Colby's Tige.
    And now breeding begins, and it will raise or fall.
    It just sucks to read all the time about OFRN when it's just not true.
    And just because there is some english bred dogs (not related to the irish OF stuff) through Colby in them OFRN doesn't make them Colby dogs of irish heritage. Colby's Tige was the closest dog in relation to the Lightner dogs (OFR), even with the 'english' cross (dogs down from Pilot). What a luck that the double Tige breeding produced a few red one's, lol.
    Well, the next steps are simple. You breed back into the pure OFR stuff to keep it tight. This means, breeding back to the Colby dogs would be the wrong direction.
    What would you call a dog like Colby's Galtie ? OFRN ?

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