working am staff

only one way to find out.... lol

 

Five season and going strong. He has caught easily over a 100 hogs.
[video=youtube_share;Im1Quueafxo]http://youtu.be/Im1Quueafxo[/video]

 

[video=youtube_share;Im1Quueafxo]http://youtu.be/Im1Quueafxo[/video]
http://youtu.be/Im1Quueafxo

 

that sounds like a good solid catch dog to me .And if he produces good dogs that fit in to your program thats even better..It sounds like your doin well my man.Keep it up.

 

Here's a show dog, working.
[video=youtube_share;Im1Quueafxo]http://youtu.be/Im1Quueafxo[/video]

 

For big boars a cross works better. Working Dane or Bullarab crossed with gamedog or Amstaff. Same with Ambulldogs. In far north Qld had a gamedog cross Bullarab bitch that worked well. Had a Ambulldog crossed with Deerhound/ Dane bitch that killed a 100kg boar gutted. Took her 4 hours. Never got to cross her with my Bullarab as she used to crack snakes like a whip. Tried it on a big Taipan one day. It bit her on the eye and she was dead within 20 minutes. My dogs would be injured now and then but I don't think pig hunting shows the gameness in a dog. Dogs that can hold a big boar fine would be a cowering mess in an accidental fight with a more determined dog. Farmer brought me a dead cow over one day to feed my dogs. After I had gutted it a squabble erupted over the heart and the liver. Bullarab bitch cross gamedog whipped the Bullarab which I had mated with her. Two of their sons (litter mates) got into it too. The one that physically resembled the mother trounced his Bullarab look alike brother. I don't think the holding ability of a dog on a pig gives any indication of their ability with regards to canine competition. In fact the docility of a dog in a hunting situation around fellow dogs might be saying that that dog would not be a good choice to match against another dog.

 

The definition of Game/Gameness:

Game or Gameness is a quality of fighting dogs or working terriers that are selectively bred and conditioned from a very early age to develop traits of eagerness despite the threat of substantive injury. Dogs displaying this trait can also be described as persevering, ready and willing, full of fight, spirited, or plucky.[1]

Well in my opinion and occurring to the definition of Game/Gameness; a dog must be game, first of all to go straight in and catch a hog of whatever size & hold it. Because not every breed will go in and catch. I'm just saying.

 

good breeders will breed what fits thier needs..thier have been and still are pure game dogs being used for catch work..Simple explanation is some people enjoy both sports and then you have some people who wouldnt own and work any other breed on a wild boar..And not all gamedogs are bat shit crazy some can handle being around other dogs and some cant..It all comes down to what types of dogs the breeders keep in thier programs.Thier is only one way gameness can be seen.Thier is no other way.

 

It doesnt take a cross of 2 diff breeds..The APBT is capable of catching your bigger boars..Now if you take a tight bred bulldog from a certain family you may have some probs on your bigger boars..Now you take a 50 50 bloodline cross from the APBT breed they can and should be able to handle anything...I keep lots of hybris vigor in my catch dogs..I wouldnt use a tight bred dog for catch work..With that being said thier are some familes bred tight that is capable so I am not putting all the families in one boat.

 

sorry bout the spelling...dam phone sucks..meant hybrid vigor.

 

My point is that Amstaffs aren't the be all end all dog when it comes to pigging. There are plenty of different breeds that can do the job well. Some pigs will kill any dog. There was one near Tully that had gone through 18 pig dogs when I left the tablelands. Don't know if they ever caught it. Hunter shot one in Cardwell that went 540lbs cleaned. A more suitable job to test an Amstaff I think would be feral dog extermination. I have talked to plenty of farmers in NSW and QLD that have a big problem with feral dogs. Dairy cows and cows that are calving are particularly at risk. Even small Dingo sized feral dogs can chew their udders out and kill them. So for the small sized feral dogs an athletic Amstaff would be the go as they are shy and will run away. For big feral dogs even a bully looking Amstaff could be used as the big ones are more solitary and stand their ground when confronted. Dairy farmer who lived next door to me on the Atherton tablelands actually liked the feral pigs. He looked at them as natures sanitarian. The pigs would come out of the rainforest at night or on a cooler wet day and clean up cow carcases in no time. He was forever losing cows to dogs and tick paralysis. He crossed Brahman into his dairy cows to improve their tick resistance and their ability to fight feral dogs as a herd.

 

that's a nice working AST, can i ask his pedigree pleaz ? does he come from a working line ? i know there still a few outhere(big up to them)!

 

show amstaff



show staffords



not all is black or white, some dogs might do good independently of breed or pedigrees


Txhogman22
great work

 

ive often wondered about this aswell, an amstaff simply being a apbt blood dog, should in theory be the 2nd best out there?? compare that to an English bull terrier ( 100 yrs ? plus?) from box dogs or amstaff and American bulldog? ....

 

People confusing gameness and aggressiveness. It's not the same thing. As for pig hunting crosses work better simply because a game dog will not usually work well with other dogs and are too aggressive to the pig and end up getting damaged. Holders or (luggers) as they are known. If they are too aggressive they always end up damaged or killed by a boar at some stage.

A good bay dog that will lug on command or is smart enough to let go of a hold and bay the pig until help arrives if it is in trouble with a big boar will have a longer life than a dog trying to go gung ho on a large boar. A dog that will hunt pigs is absolutely no guide to if a dog is game or not.
As for hunting pigs the type of dog will vary compared to the terrain it hunts in. Dogs that hunt in thick scrub will be different to plains dogs the most common here are a few dogs that hunt from a ute (pickup) A finder the one that air scents and finds is often more of a bay dog together with some that will lug and hold.

 

Nothing to do with agressive, gamedogs that works in the hunting and get damaged it is because they are too offensive and bred to fight vs dogs and so try to make the same fight with the pig. But I agree they get damages much more than a breed specific for hunting that will not be offensive and not "attack" the pig as if it was a dog.

 

Here is one I had, he was very DA and showed a hard mouth...acted just as good as my game bred dogs. at 8 months he showed me things that had me scratching my head....

ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [468573] :: BLACK ROCK'S MURPHY

 

Genetically they are the same dog... as are about 14 other species of bulldog even the Boston Terrier.. Scientifically proven THERE IS NO PIT BULL breed rather they're all Pit Bull types real dogmen know theyre all Bulldogs the APBT is the mother strain once called bulldog and once thrown in the [] forever dubbed "pit bull", kept pure by breeding for performance and sound mind always first and foremost before looks or size.

http://www.purebrednz.com/mars_veterinary_wisdom_%20panel.htm

besides the fact that in the 50-60s there were still CH game SBTs, ASTs, and dogs registered as all three AST, SBT, and APBT.. SO thats the proof right there, they're all the same. What defines them??? Performance as with any working breed. DNA and mtDna go back 1000 yrs (thats usable DNA) as the sources pull traits from that far back for each individual of course the front four gen matter and the WHOLE 10 even more so, and so on... ... simplify it like this.. Breed an APBT to any Bulldog or mastif type dog.. its going to be dominated by APBT .. breed a wolf to any husky or nordic type dog its going to be dominated by wolf .. because they are of each other .. Wolf, Dog, Sub species of dog, strain, and sub strains.. So as the nordics are still very closely related to the wolf in coding the bulldog and mastiff type dogs are as well. ... If a good dogman took all his best working dog that fit the AST bill, ( his dogs at chain weight LOL) then of course you'd have working AST. Of course they're out there...

Kudos to those still using the dogs for function.. Gotta give the dogs a purpose, they're a tool the companionship is the perk!!

as for the lot of the whole............ show and work ... that seperates the lot of em. Rev Howard Heinzl good ol words somthin like:

 

Wow, for once have the exactly same opinion. I always had this point of view. Pitbull is not a breed, a color, a physique, size, weight. What defines a PIT bull and then called Bulldog is a dog that went in the [] and proved, no matter what he looks like. A dog that is bred for show, no matter his pedigree, his look, he is ADBA or whatever, he will be call an amstaff!

Not so much people have the same opinion, pleasure to finally read this stuff here!

 

im with you on this one but what about hunting dogs?
they do not go to the square and do not go to beauty dog shows, where do they stand?