why our dogs are in sad shape

Oh, I meant that it is something very commonly diagnosed when in fact many kids are just kids. I wasen't directing that at you at all. That's another peeve of mine, but my ex most definately needed his meds and my brother probably had some other mental thing, but genetic none the less.

 

Has anyone thought that maybe there wouldn't be the number of defects in the human race if we would choose out mates more carefully & think more carefully about letting the defective breed??

As for where the line is drawn, that is simple. If the defect is found to be genetic in nature & affects the health & welfare of the child, it should not be passed on. Simple as that.

As Seal said, some ppl are breeding out just of WANT. They WANT a child when in fact we should be putting the health & welfare of the child (or dog) before our wants.

JMHO ...

 

I was side-stepping this thread as its just bound to cause a war. I guess I will add some insight though. My step-sister developed a mental inbalance at a young age, she was always "twitchy" and very emotional and unpredictable. Well, she grows up, stops taking her medicine and gets worse 10 fold. So of course, the natural thing to do in her mind was have babies immediately. She had a young son (my nephew) who is so out of it most of the time. This kid inherited her mental illness and its such a hard thing to see him suffering because of my irrational sister. On top of that, she is an unstable parent and has all but neglected this poor child. We have been doing everything in our power to get custody of the child away from her, unfortunately shes a good liar due to believing her own lies until they become rality, and she has a friend in Child Services who she has manipulated into helping her out and is now all but untouchable until she is caught in the act that she cant lie and manipulate her way out of. Whats the point of all this? Who is left to suffer because some parents are too selfish to abstain from having a child....my nephew. Does the parent care? No, it was too much for her to deal with so she had another kid that didnt have the problem. I'm sorry folks but I've seen it myself and it tears me up seeing what happens, and thus is the reason I feel strongly against it. It is always a touchy subject to discuss human birth in relation to planned "breedings" or matings. But genetic disorders are the issue here, and sometimes you need to bite your tongue to discuss it. I'm not the person to say who can have babies and who cannot, no body is.... However, that doesnt mean we need to support it. How about a human who knows they have Aids...should they risk it?

 

I had a aunt this way and the sad fact is the children suffer and we all pay for it,,,she had her own sence of what reality was and she was looney as a jaybird,,,one minute she'd agree with ya and when someone was around she didn't know what u were talking about,,,,munipulating the system,,,, when she couldn,t even take care of herself,,,,sad fact but is the truth,,,,some ppl may get offended but until u are involved in a situation like this u don't know,,,

 

ABK, our race would most definately benefit if we did choose more carefully, I think that's a fact. Everyone must be crossing the line then, I don't think I could even think of anyone who has "good" genetics. Guess I crossed that line, but then again it wasen't planned, but I gaurantee you my kids are exceptional and will be wonderful adults.

14Rock, thanks for your story, I respect you very much and know that info is personal. I really hope things work out.

I know a lot of crappy parents too, and a lot of people who are perfectly healthy but probably wouldn't take care of a kid, but it's hard to say until it happens. It's just life and just as we should have the right to own any breed we want, we should have the right to have kids with known risks. Seriously, you think BSL sucks, just watch people try and take the right for us to have kids away! "I'm sorry ma'am, but it shows here you have a genetic impurity!"

Again, have there not been good game dogs who have been bred with known flaws?

 

Yes, our repeated & wanton "breeding" practices are the source of out over 400 genetic defects & IMO if some folks would use a little compassion, it might not be as bad as it is.

And I agree there are a lot of seemingly healthy parents that don't need to have kids. But if you will look below the surface I think you will find them genetically defective too. It has been found that hormones triggered during the birthing process are responsible for a mother's desire to nurture her child. If these hormones are lacking or absent, you get a mother who doesn't give a flip about her kids. Also, addictive personalities lead to things like drug abuse which can lead to child neglect. Both are defects IMO that affect the health & welfare of the child & just as I wouldn't look favorably upon a person w/ Downs syndrome or cerebral palsy having a kid, not do I look favorably upon those aforementioned types of parents either.

And yes, there were defective gamedogs bred. But these dogs didn't have hip dysplasia, detached retinas or any other physical defect. They were biters, which was not a defect that would affect the health & welfare of their pups. When they bred Bullyson they didn't get any crippled pups!

 

Right there is where you are wrong. If she cannot take care of it she has NO business having a kid on purpose. What if the husband dies car wreck, work, accident, ect. What then the baby just sits in a crib in its own feces and rotts. Because she has the right to have it when she cant even take care of it? What happens if the husband says "to hell with this" and leaves? then what? She cant even take care of herself let alone a baby.

 

Come on, you're being dramatic. You cut a piece out of my statement. There are many physically crippled people who by-pass their lack of limbs fine. There is even a mother who has no arms, drives a car and changes her kids diapers.

Life is just full of this crap, what do you want? The kid is born, lets just hope for the best, I'm sure that kid will grow up well.

 

http://www.aclu.org/disability/index.html

 

one problem i see with the human race is we are missing the " only the strong survive" like animals in the wild. that is how a species thrives, by the strong breeding, the weak and sick are culled from the population and dont get a choice, thus a healthy population.

 

If we as humans bred like we do our animals, we'd have a much healthier gene pool...and probably less Humaniacs and PETA members....lol (not kidding). You take two people with defects and breed them, you're gonna lock in the defects. They may not show up in the first generation or so, but they're still there. Now, I know I'm gonna get flamed for my views and I say good, bring it on. This has been in my mind for many years....

 

Someone once told me the solution to Abortion is stop letting stupid people breed. Well the point is Stupid people do dumb things Thats why our dogs are in SAD SHAPE. People will always breed imperfections, With no care about the Pain and suffering it will cause. We are stupid enough to think that someday we can fix them. All Because of our selfish wants and needs.

 

If these were dogs, I would definately cull the parents from the gene pool. I find it selfish and irresponsible of them to perpetuate this genetic fault. Tho their child may not have the defect, it is genetic and he can possibly pass it on to his children in the future. Sounds rough, I know, but the world is an overpopulated place as it is, and survival of the fittest is less of an issue with the advances in medicines and treatment. We may be advancing and surviving longer, but at what cost? Our gene pool is probably in worse shape than our dogs. When it comes right down to the crunch, how many of us would be able to survive without all the nifty products and advancements of the day. We have weakend ourselves physically (immunity), strengthened our adversaries (diseases,illnesses), and add obesity, laziness etc......its a sad state of affairs. Computers, video games, etc, our kids are being softened up even more. I may be old fashioned, but I'm not pleased with where this seems to be leading. I don't own video games, the only time the T.V. is on is to watch an occasional movie, and being on the computer is a minor form of entertainment to pass a few minutes. I can do without all of the above as the internet is the downfall of our breed anyways.

Just my dollars worth, take it or leave it as you will. Common sense seems to have left the building anyways.

 

Not flaming, but alot of people's defectsd are also a cause of polution and toxics in the air, ground, water, paint, factories, buildings.. you name it! Perfectly healthy people have children with disablilites all the time..

I think thy view the issue as its their right to have children (which there's no law that says they cannot) We have the Americans with Disablitlies act to uphold their rights and freedoms. Granted they do not share in some of the same privliges we do (such as driving a car..but even then some can and do!)

But the Crash lol, dont forget abouth the "back yard breeders" lol.. wow, sort of gives a new twist on it lmao.. and there already are child peddlers ..

Doesnt some countries already have restrcitions on how many children one can have? Oh yea.. communist china.

 

What happened to being "free". Hell if i wanna breed a certain type of dog why cant I? And how the hell do you know where ur tax money goes? They probably stopped the game cause they couldnt tax that.

 

SAjoseph.....................interesting...........I am in the same field as you are in (working with the dd population) you have some very interesting points and i have clients that are multi generational. Three generations of DD in the same family. And I have some issues with all this too. However i have payed my bills for years because of the system and the way it works. Kind of conveluted isn't it?


Yes there are many reasons why people have DD children, pollution toxins etc. I think about a third of cases are unknown as to why, two thirds are tracable to some reason.

As to canines.........My GR has HD and the breeder only had one parent OFA'd although as far as I know my pup is the olny one that has had this issue.....

......................................................Grant

 

Unless BSL is in effect in your area, you generally can breed dogs if you want to. Just because breeding is legal does not make it intelligent or ethical to do so.

Anyway, organized fighting between humans (boxing) is legal, so are casinos and other forms of gambling. If the government only cared about getting tax money out of dog fighting, they could do so easily enough.

How do we know where tax money goes? Government budgets ae a matter of public record.

 

Believe what you want

 

Yes, organized fighting between humans is legal, and so is gambling within strictly regulated confines. The reason these activities are legal is because they're easily regulated as to the revenue generated by them. A boxing match is greatly publicized and revered, so it's easy for the government to get it's cut...VERY IMPORTANT to politicians. Gambling in casinos is contained and heavily regulated so profits are easily calculated to be taxed...VERY IMPORTANT. Gambling outside of casinos and OTB is illegal because the greedy government has no way of getting it's blood money. Matching of dogs has been done underground for a long time and is easily hidden from view, so it's not easily taxed. And in reality any money gambled on a match is not often enough to make it worth regulating for the government to get its almighty cut. So they bowed to humaniac pressure and outlawed it. Once again Politics = MONEY.

 

BUT-Having said your parts, dog fighting is still different. Yes we have boxing, tough man contests, but humans use pure stregnth and power, dogs use teeh. They rip and shred. For a human fight to turn out devastating, one must suffer hard blows to the temple or chest, or have an underlying medical problem to begin with. Dogs go for the BLOOD and fight until death. THAT is inhumane no matter how you look at it.


For Christs sake, the general population nowadays think that the death penalty is inhumane as well.They took Ol Sparky away from us and started lethel injection, which is also getting negative feedback.

There IS a difference between human fighting and animal fighting, and no matter how you compare it, dog fighting SHOULD FOREVER remain illegal, whether the government can collect $$ on it or not, until they decide to put muzzles or puul or their teeth prior to just compare the stregnth, endurance and drive without actually shredding their opponents to death.

I understand the is a "game dog" discussion board. And I am still a "newbie" here, but honestly, through first impressions to the general public, EVERYONE(the majority) are always talking about game-referring to death and fighting. The vibes from alot of you are that you still beleive it should still exist."My dog can kill any other dog" "The government would make it legal if they could tax it""What crosses can I mix my dog with to make it more of a guard dog?"

Go ahead, start the flaming..