Southern Kennels

Idk if those pics came through or not but they are kiddos with their game dogs

 

Here

 

• Pitbulls rank 4th out of 122, according to the American Temperament Test Society, in terms of most affectionate and least aggressive dog breeds. This was copied and pasted. Real APBTs are amazing animals. It’s breeding that has taken them downhill. I’m not saying they aren’t gladiators. They obviously are. But this weak nerved dog that’s unstable and will kill children and attack their owners are all do to bad breeding practices. There is more than one way to skin a cat and bad breeders who don’t understand genetics have lost the breed. Look at the temperament of Navy Seals. Arguably the best warriors on the planet. Are these men cloudy headed nerve bags that will get upset and attack their commanding officer when they get worked up? No, they are cool calm and collected - STRONG NERVES. But when it comes time to work - they are killers who don’t quit when things get tough. They are tested and the weak nerved guys always quit when the stress level gets too high for their nerve base. Again, you can have a bloodline of game dogs who have what I would call garbage temperaments. They will still fight. Or you could have a far superior dog where the focus genetically was not only on fighting ability gameness etc but also nerves confidence clear headedness etc. those are the navy seals of game dogs. They are above most of the game dogs I’ve herd about on here. And that’s why I understnad what Chico is saying when he says to have the best. Because just like him, I understand genetics. He obviously studied as well

 

I understand a dog getting worked up and pulling and twisting etc. that’s just drive coming out. What I don’t understand is the guy who said it’s alpha for a dog to redirect its aggression onto its owner. It’s not alpha. It’s a weak nerved cloudy headed dog that I would never breed. I would put it down because it’s not breed worthy. Those are the genetics that ruin the APBT. It should be culled if the guy was responsible but he’s obviously not and he thinks he had a good dog when in fact he’s got a cloudy headed nerve bag that’s a menace to himself and society

 

Rank Drive = The dog's desire to be the alpha or pack leader. Dogs with high rank drive always try to dominate other dogs. They often are aggressive with almost all dogs in general. A dog with this drive will often challenge the handler. This was copied and pasted from google. Rank drive can be interspecies or intraspecies or both. In other words some dogs are very rank driven within their own species only. Some dogs are rank driven outside of their own species. Some dogs can be rank driven within their own species as well as outside of their own species. And some not at all or very low rank drive. APBTs are suppose to be very low in rank drive when talking about their relationship to humans. Yet they are very high in rank drive when it comes to their own specifies. 99% of protection dogs are very high in rank drive all across the board. This is what makes them easy to turn on by posturing up on them and making eye contact. They will respond with a challenge and go into defense or fight etc depending on the genetics and drives the dog possesses. As far as fight and flight goes you are absolutely correct. 99% of dogs will choose flight if we’re talking about facing a human that postures up. But flight drive is also a part of defense. A dog will choose to run to defend itself if it’s defensive threat display doesn’t work it’s still a part of defense the dog just hit its threshold and is defending itself by running. As far as nerves go, my definition of nerves is very close to my definition of confidence. A better definition to describe the game dogs that I’m arguing about is a dog that is not clear headed. But it also could be a weak nerved dog or a mix of both of those together. That’s why I started to add cloudy headed into my argument after I said weak nerves. Hope that makes sense

 

When I started with bulldogs 43 yrs ago it soon became clear to me what kind of meat I had in the tub. With that always in mind, none of those dogs ever got the chance to get into a kennel fight or bite a human. These dogs are generally very people-friendly, but there are exceptions to the rule. Dogs with instructions for use that are too much for many. Still amazed at how many owners have no knowledge of the breed or the knowledge they have is largely based on incorrect information.To many chefs and to less indians. The less knowledge the more chance of accidents. Use your common sense, keep your ears and eyes open and your teeth together and give the animals first class care. And don't believe the hype other then seen by yourself.

 

Here is another example of what I’m talking about with the real well bred APBT. Mike Ritland is an ex navy seal who trained the military working dogs for the seal teams. Before he became a seal, in his book he talked about how he got into breeding game APBTs. I suspect he was matching them as well but he never said that. Anyway, he said out of the 100’s of game dogs he bred he was only bitten once and it was by a female who just had puppies. My point being is that the temperament of the APBT is NOT suppose to be a dog that is a menace to humans. It’s suppose to be the opposite. And at the same time be a gladiator towards animals

 

You’re exactly right! This is how the real ones are. The best ones. Look at chicos dog Athos. He’s a champion or grand champion and at the same time a service dog that goes to public events and flys on planes with Chico. That is the best of the best. It’s not a cloudy headed menace with weak nerves. How much you wanna bet the dog that is more confident and has stronger nerves and can think clearly under stress is a better fighting dog? I’d bet my right nut. It works that way with humans as well doesn’t it? Look at the Seals. They are the best of the best. Do the seals who attack their commander because they’re worked up make the cut? No they don’t. Because they are weak cloudy minded menaces. They never make it through training because when the stress gets too much for them, they QUIT! It’s not their fault, it’s genetics. When exhaustion, pain, heat etc sets in, the weak nerved cloudy headed dog or person will quit. Only the strong nerved, clear headed, confident dog/person will stay in the fight when stress reaches their threshold. That’s the difference between the best and the good. Like I said, you don’t know enough to talk with me about dog genetics, drives, thresholds etc. You can only talk to me about your experience with mediocre dogs. You see aggression, weak nerves, cloudy mind and instability and think your dog is special. I see it for what it is. A weak minded menace who should never be bred. And as a matter of FACT. That dog doesn’t fit the temperament of the real APBT. I will post the temperament for you so you can see what a real winning game dog is suppose to be like. Not a low quality menace like you have. Make sure to read the next post I put on here so you can hopefully fix your bloodline

 

Pollo - this is what you should breed for. This is the actual standard of the real APBT. The way that it was designed to be before inexperienced breeders started breeding outside of the standard. Here you go - American Pitbull Terrier temperament
STRONG WILLED
FRIENDLY
INTELLIGENT
AFFECTIONATE
STUBBORN
LOYAL
CLOWNISH
OBEDIENT
GENTLE
COURAGEOUS
There you go pollo. I don’t see anywhere where it talks about vicious, uncontrollable, unstable, weak nerved, human aggressive, cloudy headed dogs that are ok to breed if they will redirect their aggression towards their owner. This is just what a lot of lower level dog men think they should be. They think aggression and displays of aggression is a sign of a super dog when in fact it’s a weak minded quitting dog. Let’s see that dog outlast a real one with the temperament described above. If you know dogs you understand what I just said. It’s ok to disagree I just know I’m right lol

 

Last post. Sorry just trying to make a point hopefully for breeders to clean up the breed. Chico posted this. 2 Grand champion dogs walking side by side. Clear headed dogs with strong nerves able to walk side by side because the owner said so. This is what makes the real APBT special. A gladiator, a warrior through and through, but an obedient loving loyal dog who would do anything for their master. This is what the dog was meant to be. You may have a game dog, but it’s most likely out of standard and not one of the greats.

 

My friend you've got things badly mixed up here. What you refer to as "nerves" is actually called "fear biting" and yes it applies to GSD dogs and Mallies. However you are talking about something completely different from what is being discussed here in regards to Bulldogs. And trying to tell the guys on this board your version of the truth about these dogs while at the same time telling them they don't know what they are talking about is 100% misinformed.

Most of the guys on this forum, myself included (Slim excluded) have personality problems, they don't get along with other people...however they do know A LOT about these dogs. Don't get sucked into arguing with these guys, they live for it, just try and learn from them. Allow me to explain in a different way what they are talking about. A dog uses its mouth to explore and communicate with the world. It starts at birth and the mother starts correcting its excess. However an 8 week old pup will still be very "bitey." That problem is MUCH MUCH worse in these dogs. If you are, for example, holding a dog, and it is trying to get at another dog it isn't biting you with intent to harm you, it is biting as a way to say "let the fuck go of me so I can kill that other dog." It is excitement biting. The dog is not clamping down and shaking your arm it is talking to you.

Out of 5 dogs I have had 2 where this is a pretty big problem, the worst is the pup I currently own. She has nipped at me everywhere not out of fear or anger it is just her way of showing her delight at being with me and sayin "lets go work". She nipped my thumb...twice and now it is infected. I've lost my temper a few times, but I should not since she did not mean to harm me she is just extremely driven. All of the pups from her litter have this problem to varying degrees.

This behavior is driven by an extremely strong prey and fight drive, not weak nerves or malicious intent. And since these dogs bite so hard even a nip can open you up.

 

If you are sill thinking of getting a Chico dog then you are beyond help. What you just posted is more than 100% wrong.

 

I bred to Haunch and Gary (half of Big Apple) was my mentor. Haunch was mostly regarded as a man biter. He went after people on 2 occasions before he was even 18 months. I could not even pet him. This is just more BS coming from Chico.

 

There have only be called nanny dogs since the internet , by people who keep pet pit bulls trying to give them a good image , I'd dont think they are a safe dog to be left with kids

 

The nanny dog LIE came from the animal rights advocate when they realized they could start printing money by feeding the world a lie, damning the people who bred/made the dogs and stealing them while attaching some bullshit lie. I don't need google

 

First time I ever seen reference to ' nanny dog " was from the nut job Dianne Jessop and the shit book that she wrote.
And truthfully I don't even think them dogs were even in America in the 1800's

 

Couple things, a fear biting is a dog exactly what I said, it’s a dog with weak nerves, I will post from a different source so you can see I’m not making this up. A dog who gets worked up and turns to bite its owner is a dog who is referred to as cloudy headed or not clear headed. Meaning when the dog gets worked up, it will redirect its aggression towards whoever is there because it’s unable to think clearly due to its excess of drive and its lack of stability. This is not a dog to be admired. I wouldn’t breed this dog. And no responsible professional working APBT dog breeder would either. Maybe if you were breeding a guard dog that would be ok. But not a fighting APBT. It’s unacceptable and outside of standard. Here I’m posting a pic from Leerburg.com. This is a working dog website of professionals. I highlighted the exact definition of a fear biter and how it’s directly related to weak nerves. So, apparently I do know what I’m talking about. It’s ok to argue with me. I’m all ears. But calling me ignorant when I’m correct shows who is actually ignorant. Like I said - I’m a basically a professional dog trainer. My dad trains ppds and sport dogs and is a retired k9 officer. I know dogs. I know training, I know breeding and genetics. I train dogs myself. I’m not talking out of my ass. Here is the article and I can copy past the website if you’d like to read the whole thing? Let me know.

 

I'm tapping out of this one.....

When an "expert" drops the "my daddy" line and throws up googled "facts" the argument is over.

Google as says there is no "pit bull" breed its a conglomerate of multiple breeds Yada Yada Yada Yada. If your "experience" is reading Google you already found and worship the laughing stock you need a dog from.

 

I agree with not leaving them alone with kids. I wouldn’t leave ANY dog alone with small kids. Especially any type of working dog with high prey drive. But again, real APBTs, if you read the breed standard, those dogs are safe love stable animals with kids. The problem is, people aren’t breeding to standard anymore. It’s a crap shoot. The same thing happened to the gsd. Americans ruin almost everything. You can find real good GSDs but only from Europe. They have to past a breed standard test to get certified to breed. I wish they would do that here with dog breeds. All that being said, I agree, I would never leave a small child alone with any dog. Not just an APBT