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courtesy scratch ?

Discussion in 'Dog Discussion' started by STONEY, Aug 21, 2014.

Page 2 of 5
  1. TDK

    TDK CH Dog Staff Member

    Perfect sense, Lone. You won because you finished on top. The purpose of a courtesy is usually for the purpose of a picked up dog's owner/handler seeing if his dog will still go. As a winner, and from ending up on top, it makes little sense, as you don't check gameness on top. Gameness is seen from the bottom. If you won in a rather lengthy one, and your dog had to come from behind to do so, then I see little need in that situation either.
     
    TDK, Aug 22, 2014
    #21
  2. Lonewolf

    Lonewolf Big Dog

    For some reason my edited post did not go through. I pushed send on my original post too soon. But TDK and benthere have pretty much summed up how I feel as well.

    Also a courtesy is for your own need to know and you need to be stron enough mentally in these dogs and have a good idea of what you need to see to be satisfied. There are too many different opinions with these dogs and I won't let another mans comments or opinions sway me from my own thoughts.

    I have also seen situations that everyone wants to see a courtesy and the handler opted to get the aftercare started instead. I understand this decision as well.

    This is all based on historical events and hypothetical situations.
     
    Lonewolf, Aug 22, 2014
    #22
  3. TDK

    TDK CH Dog Staff Member

    Good point. Since none of us have ever partaken, that's all we can base our views on. And yes, many times has a courtesy been declined because of aftercare being the ultimate priority. Meant to mention that, and glad you made the point, Lone.
     
    TDK, Aug 22, 2014
    #23
  4. olddog

    olddog Big Dog

    I disagree w/ giving a courtesy scratch. Non should be needed. If you know your animal well enough you should have seen enough during the contest to know whether you are taking home a quitter or a game animal who was either outclassed , got bit down by a hard mouth, lost to a poor keep or just plain quit. I would never agree to one either before or after to the looser and why the hell would you scratch if you already won???

    Olddog
     
    olddog, Aug 22, 2014
    #24
  5. STONEY

    STONEY Pup

    first i would never courtesy the winner period and second if you can not tell by holding the animal in your arms something is just wrong ....what i am referring to is the the macho people courtesy is not needed at all what so ever everything can go wrong even for the winner crazy things happen but which ever you choose use common sense and not your ego....
     
    STONEY, Aug 22, 2014
    #25
  6. Saiyagin

    Saiyagin Chihuahua

    You are blind set in your foolish ways because you simply dont fully understand Cajun Rules and you dont understand what a show is really about.
     
    Saiyagin, Aug 22, 2014
    #26
  7. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    lol what about the scratching dog that quits and then the winner standing the line ? i think that's happen before . well back in the 70's .
     
    old goat, Aug 22, 2014
    #27
  8. Saiyagin

    Saiyagin Chihuahua

    What about it???? LOL

    Yes it has happened many times before , refer back to my first (what about it?) question.
     
    Saiyagin, Aug 22, 2014
    #28
  9. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    Well it happened sometimes so why not see if they will come . Someone would catch before it got there .
     
    old goat, Aug 22, 2014
    #29
  10. TDK

    TDK CH Dog Staff Member

    Guys, you could do a short write up of 2 different events which ended with one dog besting the other, and the scenario would sound pretty much the same. Yet.....each event may not have gone anything like the other in ebb and flow, and in reality.

    I think Ben, Lone and myself are in step with each other when we say you'd be hard pressed to show me much reason to courtesy a winning dog. But there ARE circumstances whereby someone just may want to be totally convinced he is after caring for and taking home a truly game dog, as in one he picked up and conceded to the other dog. Now, PERSONALLY, and I believe Ben mentioned the same, I see it stupid to scratch a winning dog into a dog that is totally without anything left. BEATEN by serious drubbing. I think that's not sportsman like. Further abuse of a game dog one should take home.

    But then, if one feels he wants to see a courtesy from the dog he picked up, and it is physically possible, then it's his feed he's slippin' into the pans. I think if this is done with proper concern for the dog, and it's agreeable to the other side, that it's his prerogative to do so.

    Most seasoned dog people pick up when they know they have no more chance to win. Not always do they let a dog in dire straits that it can't overcome, stay there and take unnecessary shit. Knowing when that point is, is crucial. And when one does such, and does such knowing he can do such, give aftercare for, save and take home a game dog, then it is HIS prerogative to do so. Whether I would do the same in the same situation, or whether you would, is of no consequence.

    It may not suit you, and it may not suit me.....but there can be and has been before, a place for such if done smartly and with care and great respect for that possibly very game dog. Common sense applies. If the dog you pick up has already made enough game scratches, then pick up, give the dog the ultimate in aftercare, and take your game dog home. It's nothing more than sensible and fair judgement which needs to be involved and applied. There is NO blanket yea or nay to it. It's all a matter of having good sense and experience, and a matter of fairness and the proper treatment of your dog.

    I see nothing as silly unless it's one of the no nos we've already talked about. There is an occasional place for it, if done properly.
     
    TDK, Aug 22, 2014
    #30
  11. Dannyb

    Dannyb Big Dog

    Isn't it a scratching contest anyway? Unless one expires, jump and runs, is picked up, or disqualified?
     
    Dannyb, Aug 22, 2014
    #31
  12. Saiyagin

    Saiyagin Chihuahua

    What ever your personal reasons for doing a courtesy scratch is your own I am not here to debate about the reasons for doing a courtesy.

    A Courtesy scratch is OPTIONAL and NOT mandatory. Since a Courtesy scratch has no bearing on the out come of a show it is basically not needed. Like Lonewolf and some others have stated a courtesy scratch is basically for your own personal experience/reason
     
    Saiyagin, Aug 22, 2014
    #32
  13. TDK

    TDK CH Dog Staff Member

    Yes, Speedo. Well said and true.
     
    TDK, Aug 22, 2014
    #33
  14. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    LOL Sai , don't you think i know that ? If you have a good ref he would of caught the dog before it got there . And lol i'm old i think i would know the old cajun .
     
    old goat, Aug 22, 2014
    #34
  15. Saiyagin

    Saiyagin Chihuahua

    I dont know what you know Old Goat BUT Age doesnt have much to do with someone Fully understanding and comprehending Cajun Rules.

    Is it the refs job to handle the dog after the show is over? Once the show is over the Ref has no authority/power in personal matters meaning you could touch your own dog and tail scratch your dog if you wanted too.
     
    Saiyagin, Aug 22, 2014
    #35
  16. olddog

    olddog Big Dog

    TDK, as you said "It may not suit you, and it may not suit me.....but there can be and has been before, a place for such if done smartly and with care and great respect for that possibly very game dog.Common sense applies". It seems that common sense is not so common any more, nor are good dog men. It seems that Good Dog Men , like Good Dogs, are where you find them. You know when you find them because their word as well as their handshake are their bond and honesty in all their dealings with dogs is paramount. Stopping a competition one should err on the side of saving the dog as deciding to put the dog down or giving it away can always be done latter if you decide the dog is not worth feeding.

    Olddog
     
    olddog, Aug 22, 2014
    #36
  17. stinkrock

    stinkrock Top Dog

    I never did courtesy scratch win or lose. I believe if one of mine quits or stops it's no reason to see if it will go. Because I have no use or reason to keep it around, even if it did go.

    An if he won I still see no reason to see if it will go. I once seen it back fire on a young guy who was talked into doing it after he won. When his dog went an made contact the other dog bit down on his face an held on. By the t o me they where separated the wining dog lost an eye.
     
    stinkrock, Aug 22, 2014
    #37
  18. Zylonist

    Zylonist Big Dog

    ^^^^"Most seasoned dog people pick up when they know they have no more chance to win. Not always do they let a dog in dire straits that it can't overcome, stay there and take unnecessary shit. Knowing when that point is, is crucial." TDK you sir are a dogman, I agree with this statement completely. There is no shame in losing....
     
    Zylonist, Aug 22, 2014
    #38
  19. old goat

    old goat CH Dog

    lol Sai , only if you ask the ref to catch the dog before it gets there . I don't care either way . I know some guys would want to show you they would scratch and they stand the line . That was the point . If you pick up you may want to see if they will go and they would ask the ref to catch them before they hit .
     
    old goat, Aug 22, 2014
    #39
  20. TDK

    TDK CH Dog Staff Member

    I'm not sure what a ref would have to do with it but to point to the winning dog and declare it the winner if the other side concedes. I guess if you discussed something in line with what OG is talking about with Saiy, then ok. I am one who believes fully in discussing as many possibilities as possible and what will be the rule if any of those things should occur. The rules of most competition has some modification to the written rules, anyway.

    As far as a dog that has already quit, Stinkrock, I don't believe that dog is involved with this discussion.
     
    TDK, Aug 22, 2014
    #40
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