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Geez, 5 years for dogfighting

Discussion in 'Dog Discussion' started by Jefferson, Nov 5, 2014.

  1. TreyKen

    TreyKen Banned

    There's no agreeing to disagree when it comes to dog fighting or any type of activity that harms another living creature. You can't respect the dog?? Stop already. You are sounding more & more ignorant as you talk. I hope you don't have children & spread your ignorance.

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  2. TreyKen

    TreyKen Banned

    Additionally, are you really trying to say a dog wouldn't fight if they didn't want to fight?? They don't know a different life than what they were trained for. They want to please their owner. I feel sorry for you as you are a female that is lacking in basic compassion.

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  3. Michele

    Michele CH Dog Super Moderator

    We will have to agree to disagree. And since you don't know me, I'll let you in on a little secret. I am one of the most compassionate people you could ever meet. Those that know me, know that.

    Oh yea, I do have children. A daughter that lives in Italy whom I'm very proud of. She's an animal lover, as I am. She's just as compassionate as I am.
  4. TreyKen

    TreyKen Banned

    Words don't mean anything and that's just what yours are. Anyone that believes that we need to agree to disagree on dog fighting condones it. So keep believing you are a good person.

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  5. Michele

    Michele CH Dog Super Moderator

    I guess we won't be meeting for coffee and a chat....
  6. treezpitz

    treezpitz CH Dog Staff Member

    "or any type of activity that harms another living creature."

    I know for a fact from your comment above that you are a vegetarian and don't eat meat, correct?
  7. Michele

    Michele CH Dog Super Moderator

    Someone banned him/her so they cannot answer you.
  8. Vicki

    Vicki Administrator Staff Member

  9. Michele

    Michele CH Dog Super Moderator

  10. treezpitz

    treezpitz CH Dog Staff Member

  11. Laced Wit Game

    Laced Wit Game Yard Boy

  12. treezpitz

    treezpitz CH Dog Staff Member

    lol That was funny. "Make em earn that money" lol
  13. Saiyagin

    Saiyagin Chihuahua

    I was waiting for other experienced members to respond to Vicki's post but since no one has responded yet I guess I will have to be the first one to respond to her.

    From what you wrote it seems you have some conflicting thoughts or misconception due to what ever reasons. I am responding to shed a little light on to the truth.

    Actually the word FORCE is NOT the correct definition of combining two game bred dogs in a box for combat.

    The correct definition of combining two game bred dogs in a box for combat is called a OPPORTUNITY/SITUATION/CHANCE

    A extremely dog aggressive dog ONLY needs a opportunity/chance to display his aggression, there is NO force involved.

    A dog aggressive dog is NOT compelled to do it because of any outside influence as the dog is MORE then willing to do it on his OWN without any force involved the only thing he needs to display his willingness to do it is a CHANCE/OPPORTUNITY.

    The reason these dogs were created is for combat which is for entertainment or sport. Greed and gambling is a natural secondary side effect of any sport.
    Vicki likes this.
  14. Vicki

    Vicki Administrator Staff Member

    Oh, for shit's sake, I had a whole post typed out and the damn internet ate it.

    This much I agree with, but when you're hauling a dog to the box, by train, plane or automobile, chance and opportunity are completely different animals.

    Opportunity is defined as
    1.an appropriate or favorable time or occasion: Their meeting afforded an opportunity to exchange views.

    2.a situation or condition favorable for attainment of a goal.
    3.a good position, chance, or prospect, as for advancement or success.

    Man provides the opportunity, not the dog.

    Chance....not a chance. A chance is the absence of any cause of events that can be predicted, understood, or controlled: often personified or treated as a positive agency.

    Once again, the man is taking his dog to a predetermined location. The dog didn't walk there himself.

    Only man can get the dog to the box, that's not opportunity or chance for the dog. A match is predetermined. The dogs aren't siting around playing poker talking about what match they are going to.

    The dog is put in a situation by force. Man is exerting his power over the animal by taking out, and using the situation to take advantage of the dogs' natural aggression.

    Force: to press, urge, or exert (an animal, person, etc.) to violent effort or to the utmost.

    Thanks Sai, for shedding some light on this inexperienced member. ;)
  15. Saiyagin

    Saiyagin Chihuahua

    You still dont get it Vicki. The dog is NOT put in a situation by force. The dog himself will take every opportunity it has to fight another dog in any situation if the situation or opportunity so arises because he is DOG AGGRESSIVE. The situation wont make the dog aggressive if the dog is NOT aggressive towards other dogs its that simple logic you fail to grasp vicki.

    Since you claim only man can bring a dog to a box in which you claim is force let me ask you this vicki. If you bring a dog to a park for agility training is that force? If you bring your dog to a weight pulling competition is that force? If you bring your dog to the beach for swimming is that force? If you bring your dog to hunt wild boar is that force? If you bring your dog to a dock jumping competition is that force? By bringing your dog and putting it in that situation or opportunity is NOT force. You cant force a dog to do something it does NOT want to do. If I bring two chihuahuas into a box I can NOT force them to fight if they dont want to its that simple , if you dont get it by now vicki you probably never will but Im done explaining LOL.
    Mudville_Monsta likes this.
  16. LHolt29

    LHolt29 Pup

    This is going to be a lot for my first post, but I've been thinking a lot about this topic lately and I guess it can't hurt to shre my opinion.

    Wether TreyKen was a troll or not, there are many people who share the exact viewpoint that he has, with complete sincerity. It is easy to take up that opinion when you have only been involved with pet dogs. It is even easier when you have worked in animal rescue and have seen firsthand the aftermath of real animal abuse.

    The average person does not seperate thugs from real dogmen when they think of dogfighting - to them, it is all the same, and engaging in any kind of argument with them usually only fuels their fire further. And I can't disrespect someone for caring about animals and not wanting to see them get hurt. But the subjct of game dogs is many-layered, and attempting to explain it in hopes of the other person understanding and accepting what these dogs are all about is more than can ever be accomplished by arguing over the internet. A person has to be willing to learn, to see things from a different point of view, one that might even be uncomfortable for them.

    I used to be one of those people who viewed all dogfighting as bad. But I have found, through learning about the dogs, that there is a gray area, and that there is a difference between thugs torturing dogs and throwing them away in the name of money, and the matching that created the American Pit Bull Terrier (not that money played no part in traditional matching, but that's a whole nother story). It is ironic that so many people who claim to be Pit Bull lovers, enthisiats, and advocates, don't respect the people who CREATED the Pit Bull! In order to truly love a breed, you must understand them, and denying what the breed was created to do is a far cry from any real understanding.

    I would not personally ever match a dog, but I do not take it upon myself to tell others that they can not do it. I am not a god, nor am I a dogman, so what would my credentials be? There are certain things that I know are wrong, and animal abuse is one of them. Causing undue pain to an animal, making it sufffer mentally or physically, that should never be. Those things should be looked down upon universally. But simply allowing APBT's to be APBT's isn't abuse. The're is more animal abuse going on in the food industry in America than has ever been associated with game dogs, but no one seems to care about that...hell, there are millions of healthy animals euthanized every year in the US alone simply because there is not enough space, not enough money, not enough homes. Instead of worrying so much about matching, I would much rather see animal advocates put their time, money, and effort into something that will really make a difference in the world.
    Vicki likes this.
  17. Vicki

    Vicki Administrator Staff Member

    You make a good point, however.....well, since you're done explaining to me because I don't view the same actions within the confines of YOUR definitions, I'm wasting my time.

    So, when you TAKE a dog somewhere, like for agility, weight pulling, swimming, hunting, the dog is not forced to face off with another dog. There will be no dog needing an IV, shock treatment or after care.

    Sports and interaction with your dog are no comparison, as these don't involve gambling, or intended harm to the animal. These are not what man intended for these dogs. He intended them to fight, to take advantage of their natural aggression.

    You sure can force a dog to do agility, but why? There won't be a good response, as it requires positive reinforcement and be something the dog loves to do. With swimming, if you throw the dog in, yep, you're forcing him, it's sink or swim. You sure can use the word force if you're taking the dog somewhere, and it can be a positive thing, depending on one's intent.

    The original intent for dog fighting was something to gamble upon. Putting two animals in a box to fight, whether to the finish or one gets picked up is purely for man's enjoyment and pockets, not the animals'. It is simply taking advantage of a trait that man bred the animal for.

    Chihuahuas are not bred to be in combat, so, no they probably won't fight...with added incentive, as your ankle to bite, however, may incite some arguing.

  18. treezpitz

    treezpitz CH Dog Staff Member

    Vicki and Saiy, those are some good posts that make some good sense, depending on how you view the situation. I will disagree with Vicki that hog hunting dogs do need IVs or shock treatment sometimes, and that is a totally legal activity. Saiy's posts do make a lot of sense and I'm not sure I would have worded it the way he did.

    Lholt29, good post. I'm glad you have a open mind and willing to embrace the history behind this breed.
  19. Michele

    Michele CH Dog Super Moderator

    True...but sometimes I really wonder about those chihuahuas. They are pretty feisty.
  20. poorfarmkennels

    poorfarmkennels Big Dog

    It takes force to stop bulldogs from fighting.

    if they are forced to fight would ther be quitters?

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