HELP!! Multiple sire litter but dam owner doesn't want to DNA

Ladies & gentleman, I have a bit of a problem. I person who I respect had a litter. The gyp was bred once by the male he selected & once by a blue dog his neighbor owned. He said none of the pups were blue so the blue dog could not be the sire. But as we all know, the gene that causes blue is recessive. So I advised that if the gyp didn't carry that recessive gene no mattter if she were bred to 100 blue dogs it would not show in her pups. He assured me he would DNA the litter, but has not! Out of the litter he kept some, gave some to the stud's owner & gave one to a friend. I do not know if he disclosed the fact the pups may not be off the selected stud. What should I do?? I have no doubt that 1 or all 3 of these people will breed these dogs in the future. This young man seems to be a real good guy & is just getting in the dogs. I advised him that if he is caught paper hanging it would be something that would forever follow him in his career in the dogs. I am very worried for both him & the dogs. What can I do - help!!

 

you stated right off the get go "a person i respect had a litter".....the first thing i would do is lose the respect real quick. as for the pups, thats a mess. do you want to get yourself involved in that? whats it cost to do the DNA.... 25 bucks? if he was truly concerned it would have been done already. just worry about yours and let others worry about theirs.

 

i wouldn't give a fuck because i ain't feeding them. if folks don't want to get to know your "friend" & figure out what type of fella he is. that's on them & they pay for it in the long run.

 

DNA is $40 per dog - $40 for the sire, $40 for the dam & $40 for each pup. So he's looking at several hundred dollars.

I really hate to see this young man get off on a bad start & I feel extra bad for those who have to "learn the hard way." Us not giving a phuk is why so many people make mistakes nowadays like buying AmBullys & thinking they're pit bulls, etc. I would like to save both him & them from a terrible mistake. (I think the blue dog that bred her - by accident - was an AmBully)

This young man came to me for help & seemed really open & willing to learn, but he shut down on me when he found out how much it was to DNA pups. I guess I feel responsible for him, I hate to see this young man get off on the wrong foot, but I guess that is his decision.

Peace & happiness...

 

EDIT: I will say this, I have to give this young man props for keeping the pups amongst his circle - himself, the stud owner & a friend. But I would be willing to bet a dime to a doughnut these dogs will be bred by someone & I do not know if he has revealed the fact to the others they may not be off the selected sire.

 

you need to go knock some sense into your friend or tell the people he gave dogs to the truth.

 

look at it this way, if DNA wasnt gonna get done, anyone concerned with the breeds best interest would have taken care of the problem day #1

 

:0047: but sometimes people HAVE to learn teh hard way. Only so much you can do right:confused:

 

I wish I knew them. I would surely do so.

As for knocking some sense into him, my fisticuff days are over. Now it's strictly shoot to kill! lol. :lol:

Until now he has seemed like a very sensible young man. I have told him over & over that if he gets caught paper hanging his reputation in the dogs will be ruined, perhaps for the rest of his life.

I corresponded with him this morning & urged that he & the other 2 people who have pups off this litter (he said there were 3 left - I assume the others have died) to save up for DNA before they do anything with these pups (it would be $120 total per person) I hope he follows that advice.

I have yet to hear back from him so I don't know what the reply will be. But I know he respects the fanciers here, so perhaps if he sees this he will come to his senses.

Blessings ...

 

Lee: When he first came to me with the info about the blue dog getting to his female we discussed it. He did not want to do spay-abort b/c he wanted to breed the bitch again in the future. He did not want to cull the litter b/c they may still have been off the selected sire. So he said he was going to wait & DNA. Now all of a sudden he says he is "convinced" the litter is off the selected sire, so I doubt DNA will be done at all.

Dream Pits: Yes, you are right. I guess the old saying "you can only help someone who wants to help themselves" comes into play here. But I hate to see someone walk right into a huge mistake that could have been avoided.

Blessings ...

 

Sure doesn't seem like the party in question is interested in doing things properly. From what you are describing I am sure that these animals will be bred, and put out there in some form. Just another fool that will let a little chump change get in his way of doing things right...it will catch up with him. On the positive side though you ain't feeding them so the first thing I would do in this situation is nothing. Take the time that you have invested in worrying about others practices, and put that back into your own yard...

 

Some people do it for the love of the breed, some do it for the money.

If you love the breed, you need to tell everybody what name to look out for, on their pedigrees.

And, you should also report the "breeder" to the Kennel Club.

If you got this person started, and he uses you for a reference, it can affect your reputation.

If you're anything like me, you would give those dogs, or any dog with questionable health away rather than worry about the money.
If you've done anything like that to improve the quality of your line.

I see no reason to let your association with a person of such low standards affect your reputation now, the way he could.

 

fblb: I "worry about others' practices" b/c ...

#1: I am emotionally invested in this young man. He came to me for help & I have nurtured this young man in the breed. Now he is taking all my help & advice & going contrary to it. No one likes to see a person they helped bloom in the breed self-destruct.

IMO more people SHOULD care about their brothers & sisters in the breed are doing. maybe there wouldn't have been any Whoppers or Gottis or deformed Razor's Edge dogs being sold as pit bulls!

#2: It can adversely affect others in my area. This young man is located in the same state I am. So it's not like these mutts will be 3000 miles away in Cali or something. They're going to right in my backyard (not literally, but figuratively).

Aloysious: I didn't get him started, but I did help him a lot. I certainly do not want my name to be associated with any of his misdeeds. But I think he has decided to go his own way anyway - my last PM to him was to spay or neuter the pups or at the very least save up to DNA before he did anything with them & I have not heard from him again.

Peace & happiness ...

 

ABK, your rep. is solid, but I really hope that if you see this person selling pups or studing out anything from his yard to the gen. public that you speak up so that dogmen new or old would at least be warned if not in open form at least in pms you gota see where this is going right..........................

 

This is a hard spot to be in and crosses that line of what is "your business" and "someone else's business". I think in this situation you are past the point of minding your own business because you have associated your name and reputation with this person by mentoring them. I think what Dred Lok said needs to be done at the least - you should find a way to let anyone getting a pup off that litter know that they may not get what they are paying for - even if you do it in a nice polite private message or letter that only that person sees. You are not trying to trash the breeder's reputation, you are trying to prevent something that happens way to much in dogs. It would really suck if someone got a pup off this litter and started breeding it and the pup turned out to be off the blue dog - it could start a whole undesirable chain of multiple generations being turned out to others that are essentially useless dogs with hung papers....

 

I would go to him and tell the man he needs to DNA the dogs.If he's in it to win it,he should want to know for his own sake that he's got what he bred for ,and not the dog next door.And if not he deffinetly needs to inform the people who are getting pups from him.And if i knew the people he was selling/placing the pups to/with,i would have no problem letting them know the truth.And if he has a problem with that than F**K him cause he wasn't never about S**T in the first place.

 

Can't soar with the eagles if you are nesting with the buzzards. I can understand what you mean, but this kid is not going about things like he even gives a shit about these dogs. It sounds like he don't care about doing the right thing like I said in my previous post. Your reputation might be solid, but when you associate yourself with people like this nothing good ever comes of it. If he is going to "self destruct" then there is nothing you can do for him. Like the old saying goes you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. If he has decided to go his own way consider yourself lucky, and wash your hands of this fool.

 

If you are talking about the same guy that I am thinking about he is lost and you are not the one to get him on track. I guess you would want him to breed some purple ribbon bs or watered down replica of a long bypassed line. You may want to concentrate on your own line before you worry about the next man.

 

Dred Lok: You are right. If I come across any of these people I will surely tell if them provided he hasn't done so already.

Adivina: This is true. Had I known he would be this type of fellow I would have told him to move on when he came to me for help. But he seemed very genuine & willing to learn so I helped him. Hopefully my name will not become entangled in all this b/c as the old saying goes "I can do bad by myself!" lol. But at least it is publicly known I do not approve of this.

James T: I have told him several times he needs to DNA the litter & why. He agreed several times but now for whatever reason he has done an about face on the matter. If i do come across anyone who has pups from this litter or pups from these pups (since we are in the same state, I might) I will certainly tell them.

fblb: You are very much right & as much as I hate to say it if he doesn't straighten up & fly right we will have to part friendship.

And I love your saying. Very inspirational & thought provoking.

magnoilaotis: IDK if he is the same fellow or not. I don't want to put his name on a public forum.

I never urged him to breed any UKC PR dogs. Shoot, I would have told him to breed to his neighbors AmBully in the 1st place if I wanted that! lol. Nor did I advise him on his game bred breeding - he had done the breeding to the selected sire before we met.

As for concentrating on my own line, don't worry, I am. I am keeping most of what I breed for myself to evaluate & use (if worthy). What I can't keep I give to close friends & yes, I do I sell a few. I do my best to keep tabs on every dog I place outside my friends & I to see how they're working out. Like anyone, I produce good dogs, cold dogs & yes, curs. I won't lie about that. Anyone who tells you they put out all good dogs all the time is either a liar or well ... a liar. I will never be a "household name" due to my refusal to break the law, but as long as I am putting dogs out there who will work, I am doing just fine. But thanks for your concern on both counts.

Peace & happiness ...

 

Well its sounds like you have done all you can do.Now is a perfect time to see what kinda of person he is.I would just sit back ,and see if he does the right thing or not.