Old Family Red

Bravo I M .let him have it!

 

Ouch lol The voice of experience hurts sometimes ....

-The only source of knowledge is experience.
Albert Einstein-

 

Just to give you some info:
V. Romero has been in europe:

Scratch Magazine Jan. 1999:
Zinetti´s Tom Cat 1W vs v. Romero & Bodyguard´s Monkey Tail 1W
Referee: Lakeman M 20 kg

The match was held at the "Italy Convention"
Tom Cat from Croatia 1x Best in Show winner son of Gr. Ch. Piah handled and conditioned by Zinetti.
Monkey from USA. Vinny said he is a younger brother to VBK´s Ch. Harvey, a 1x winner in 2 hrs 20 Min. handled and conditioned by Bodyguard.
Monkey is a bigger dog, Tom Cat smaller and fat 1/2 kg over and paid forfeit. For the first half hour there was an offensive fight from both, it was an very even battle, but Tom Cat had more mouth.
Some after, Monkey slowed down and Tom Cat took it over.
Working all over Monkey, mostly in the back end.
Vinny offered several times for a draw, Zinetti refused. Each dog ran 6 game scratches, some scratches of Monkey were truly unbelievable game, falling down, but he kept always coming back for more. At 2 hours both dogs felt to sleep in deep shock, in a mouth to mouth hold. At 2 hrs 15 min their handlers agreed to a draw. Both dogs ran deadgame the last scratches of their life, both died view hours later. Tom Cat was voted Best in Show and Monkey earned Gamest in Show trophy.

DRAW
Time: 2 : 15

Just one example!

Another one the hyped Rebel Kennel´s Muggs

Pitbull Arena Nov / Dec 1994
Boban´s Yankee vs Rebel Kennels Muggs

Muggs came from Mt. Man´s Ch. Homer R. O. M. bloodline.
Ricky Jones said about him that he is the new Gr. Ch. Sampson but Yankee didn´t think that way and when the dogs hit each other hard in the center of the ring Muggs was smashed back into his corner.
He was in panic trying to get the beast off of his chest. After only 3 mins Muggs forgot that he was a Pitbull and tried to jump over the wall. The match was over, on his courtesy Muggs didn´t go back.

Winner: Ch. Yankee 3W
Time: 0 : 03

As a side note Yankee was 9 years old at that time!
Muggs shoulder was broken!
Boban bet that Yankee will win in 30 mins
Muggs have been said to kill Ch. Bubba R. O. M. in an accidentual fight!

Also Yankee killed StB´s Tyson imported as a 2W in 8 minutes!
Tyson was out of Hargove´s Rufus and Brewer´s Susie.

Just as a side note and there are many more examples!

So only talking about minor quality rolldogs ain´t the truth either!
I think many kennels in europe could compete with kennels all over the US and the world.
Remember what Joe Corvino said! Good dogs are where you find them!

 

there were people here when all of the above "arrived..." history skipped that part for a while... other than that, GET EM!!!

 

He just made a statement on low quality of the european dogs, well that´s not the case aswell as Americans came by and competed or dogs that successfully have been matched in the US came over here and competed with different results!
The conclusion only imported stuff would be of good quality, I don´t think so and it have been proven otherwise over and over! All it depends on is the right man and the right way of selection!

Anyway, I enjoy following the thread and reading!
Keep it up!

 

Ya, that is forgotten, like my great grand mother's family.

 

I did notice in those reports, names linked to the reports but actually them there doing like Vince and Ricky.
BTW without Bob @ APRL who conditioned Chinaman, I don't think the results for Vinney wouldn't be the same.
BTW Ricky? the one Buffalo Soldier bitch slap like a rag doll with his dogs?
Come lets talk major leaguers not about some one who ratted other dogmen out!

 

BTW Zinetti´ is Ceneral Europe not Eastern.
He should remember when I was there. I gave an interview to a Yugo Mag.
Draw doesn't make you a winner.

I did see, oh what was her name?,,,,,,one married to late Steve Long that came over from Yugo and was friends with all those guys.
Well anyway, along came all those dogs, hour later out over a dozen or so, not worth a bet!

 

Iron Mike, sure draw doesn´t make you a winner, but if Tom Cat would be just a roll dog would he get that far?
How about Tyson that was a 2x in the US and then simply get destroyed?
At least Ricky knew what dogs to shop for besides ratting LOL!
See at the beginning they had to learn step by step and have been traded non worthy dogs from all parts of the world but they made a good progress and I seriously think that their competitors ain´t behind international competition anymore!
Also you have to take into consideration that they managed to get their thing going besides of war and economical suffering afterwards!
See the dutch people Bros, Wardt, BvH, Rudy and many many more, do you think they have been that far behind?
Anyways the topic is about OFRN but I hate if people are talked down that do have the right sporting spirit and almost build everything they achieved out of nothing and reached a level that is able to compete internationally!
If you are interested I could dig out some reports and type them in for you as I do have some mags left.

 

As a side note Zinetti is croatian and we germans consider them eastern europe people! LOL!

 

Scratch Magazine isn't one of that important to me. Isn't that one were Dan, Taffy and I was on the cover back in the early 90's?
Anyway you added names to those reports who didn't do the matching, just dogs sent from them.
Everyone knows the best stock never left this country.
I have yet seen a Ch. Timex, Gr. Ch. Buck, Gr. Ch. Sandman, Dl. Gr. Ch. Tornado, etc. sure to hell I didn't see a Gr. Ch. Koko type dog.
As for Croatia I was there when I went to Central Europe.
It isn't Eastern Europe

Germany, hum I sure you have seen the Grocery Store Chains with my last name on them in your country.
BTW my mother's side is Shriner and Laney, both sides, grand parents right off the boat.
Right from Bavaria Germany which I was at when I was there too.
The only way to finally find out is for them to complete at an International Level and not have some one have to come their doorstep.
I don't think thay are close to big money players at 50 to 100K.

BTW isn't Pit Dogs outlawed in Germany?
Isn't that why the German Boys Kennels got out?

 

BTW when the money is low dollar like theirs, over here they bet that much on OTC rolls. :lol:

 

Thank you for the reply mike
your earlier inaccurate statements concerning the heritage of my countrys dogs have been corrected once already
Your Vikings & the Spanish where here first comment has no relevance to anything what so ever.
“ go get your facts straight before you type“ concerns which claimed facts ?
whats good for the goose is good for the gander concerning a countrys heritage, so follow your own advice before posting disparate revisionism to a brit
“Please, I was around these dogs were you thought Bull Terrier was the only real thing” has no meaning to me what so ever , feel free to elaborate.
Finally DUDLEY is where mike?..& why the association?
Cheers.

 

Many got out in 2000 and short after.
Yes since 2000 there have been a complete ban for APBT, Am Staf, Staffbull and Bullterrier up until 2004.
Bavaria has a ban since 1991.
Today it depends on where you living!
But importing is still forbidden! The penalty is up to 10. 000 Euro and one year in.
Last week they busted one guy and taken 11 dogs.
Some are still out there but very cautious and stay within small and closed circles.
Some guys you might know of are still into dogs others thinking about getting back into but I won´t name them in public.
About the cover, can´t remember as I got rid of almost all material in 2000 only stuff was left that was stored elswhere!

 

You're welcome,
I wasn't inaccurate. It was spot on. Just like you thinking the original bulldog came solely from England when it wasn't.
And it was mutli colored. As I said on my thread about the color of Staffords.
Staffords weren't original Bulldogs.
It's hard to trace bulldogs back past the Spaniards and Italians.

"Your Vikings & the Spanish where here first comment has no relevance to anything what so ever"

Did you already forget what you wrote about the Brits and this country?
Lets get right down to it, other then the Normans, whether you are Anglo, Saxon or the original Brit of Celtic of Welsh, Irish or Scottish, all were originally from Germanic Nomadic tribes.
Either way, I don't need someone telling what my name is as a surname of when I traced it back to the source.
I don't care if your are a Brit or where ever, If you don't know the history of the world including your own country, you should learn it.

Dudley is simply a fresh color.
Dudley is not from the stock of Old Family Reds imported dogs.
That is why they are excluded from OFRNR.

Now what else would you like to learn?

 

Great thread thanks for the information

 

For one, your name being, Gaelic Game Dog, I can only assume you are on the Isle, or up in the highlands. I am trying to understand your take, not see if your shit is the same color as mine.
Did I imply you do not know who you are talking to? Dont believe so. You are talking to a bunch of ghosts.
Never said you were trying to take anything.
You are correct, they did not leave the country in the same form. They were bred to quite a few Families here in USA, I'd call New Family. Born and bred here. We need someone to add a timeline thread again, so folks can see how things fell into place.
The old stock , from the English or Brits were the typical pied dogs. They were crosses as well. The white, fancy ones went to show, while the brindled dogs(not sought after for shod prospects) went to other lines of work.
Seen you say something about this, and and this still does not follow the OFRN history, because it is a different one completely.

Another reason I was asking of you, is to see if you possibly know anyone I do from there, that I could possibly put you in touch with to help you better understand.
Pleanty of stuff to read, especially in your land.

 

I think you mush have a chapped ass and may need some cream or something. I have just let you know, that what you are reading has been writen in many titled books, and have been common talk for dog folk for about as long as the breeds history - there should not be this many questions, especially if one is able to comprehend what he is reading.

I do not have a lot more to add, just trying to help and get an understanding as to why you have so many questions.

I like I.M just fine. But dont think that we have not had a disagreement before, cause we have. We accept our differences. We both have a lot of similar interests and do not talk as often as he have in past, but we do talk, and I respect him and what he has preserved for futer dog folk.

 

Eagle - how you been. ? Want to appologise for the last time we talked. We were both stressed about our current situations and I really do miss out talks. We were both learning so much about the dogs we love, and I believe my personal life got involved, and I reacted in a way I am not proud of. Hope you will talk with me agin some day, and I promise that a new slate will be ready for new talks. Also want to see how you and your dogs are doing. Have enot seen a new pic of that lil jewel you have!!

YIS
McCoy

 

I was new just a short while ago too. I was drawn to the reds like a magnet, than I figured out why. I had to learn too. I thought there was nothing left of the dogs family members once fancied. Than I studdied, and began to see patterns, and talk to folk to get advise. A couple times, even getting in dispute over the matter. Now that I have all the facts on whats what, I "try" to help people with what I know. Sometimes it looks like I am building up certain lines, but really, these lines I love, are the only ones I have fire for.

Also - Have another thing I want to ask you, but will do so in private. I see you been on a bit more often, but would rather just shoot you an email. I have to prepare it, which may take my slow typing asrse a while, but I will as soon as I can....