Old Timers-Dogmen

it will be nice to see what other think as far as my thoughts no

 

well i don't think it would be the right path because they are 2 diffrent breeds of dogs.kind of like if a lab was in the same boat and someone said oh a golden is just a long haired lab and they are good maybe we could use those and breed the shorter haired ones back to each other and make the breed better as a whole,not gonna happen because they are 2 diffrent breeds.i think the path to getting our dogs and by our dogs i mean gamebred APBT's on track is to clean up the breeding programs.and by that i mean we old doggers need to turn up the heat on these lazy likes who have game dogs and don't keep them up proper and breed to whatever to make a buck wich i have seen happen.what we as a very large community need to do is screen more who we sell them to via closing it down and keeping them amongst ourselfs and only giving them or selling them to our apprentices or other apprentices approved by other dogmen,turn up the heat on them bluff breeders,educate the public more about what a bulldog is because they have no clue on earth as to what one is to them a big black lab might be a bulldog,clean up our breeding pracitces by culling hard when needed for the obvious flaws just pretty obvious stuff that should have been done long ago.the staffie is the show dog and the bulldog is the true form of the breed.the only reason staffies are in ''better'' shape and i use that term lightly is because they are bred strictly for looks for the show ring.very very few are bred for working ability and very few have what it takes to be a good working animal so adding that to the lines that are working animals in my opinion would weaken it as a whole.keep working animals to working animals and the others to theirs.never mix espically in the thought that it will better the breed because it won't.

 

And there you have it...EXCELLENT POST!!! The only thing I would add is instead of "Old Doggers" I think this applies to ANY current "Pit Bull Owner"...

 

very true i should have added that.but i am also going to add responsable.

 

Gotti/Greyline =TRASH

 

Thanks. Maybe hearing it from you will sink in better. Great post my brother.

 

likewise, couldn't agree more.

 

I agree that Amstaffs are not the gamebred "salvation". I have an Amstaff, and he is definately not close to looking like a gamebred pit. He is more bulky muscle than lean muscle, and he definately isn't game in any way, shape, or form. Also, though he is only 50 lbs., he looks bigger than that. I saw a lady with a dog on dogster.com. She claimed the dog was an Amstaff/Pit Bull. When I asked her how she felt about that mixture, she said, "I don't have a mixed bred dog." I didn't feel like arguing with her...
I also agree with Old Timer. The only thing that will help the gamebred dog is for the owners and breeders to be very careful about their breedings, very selective, and make sure to keep within the guidelines for the GB APBT...
As for the bullies, hopefully, they are just a faded, though if they aren't. Hopefully they do get American Bully passed, and people start being more honest about the Origins of the American Bully, and not lie saying it's a fullbred APBT, because it's obviously not.

 

So after all of those wonderfully informative replies my next question would be.....

What are we gonna do to save this breed. Like I mentioned in the original post tehre is a great cause for concern regarding the diminishing quality of the APBT.....at least in this part of the country. I know a lot of you may not feel the effects of it, especially on the east coast.

 

Best response, thank you so much....so how do you think this is going to happen?

 

well the only way i think it is going to happen is by not sitting idle and letting the current way things are going keep on going.we have got to do what i said and not just sit and talk about it.talk is just that talk but if we want a change we have to get up off our asses and make it happen ourselfs.demand that the bully breeders quit dragging our dogs names through the mud with their shoddy practices,demand that the news and papers quit labeling our breed vicious and pegging any dog attack a pitbull attack,demand that people get educated about this breed of dog,demand that byb's go out of buisness or change their breeding practices.and as far as our own practices it is not difficult to do and if you truely are a breeder you wouldn't have to change a damn thing when it comes to that.the way i described how we should control our breedings is the way i have always done things.but there has been a few who have not all they cared about was getting a big name and making money and again we have to start demanding that this changes,i am not saying we ask we demand.just like they are demanding our breed gets outlawed we start demanding they stopand so on and so forth.asking won't get you nowhere when your in a situation like this you have got to demand that your voice is heard and stand up for your selfs just like the negros did during the civil rights movement they didn't ask to stop being lynched and beat to death they demanded they start being treated like equals and if we want to save the breed before it is to late we to must do the same,and trust me it will well be worth the rewards we will get in the end.

 

"I know a lot of you may not feel the effects of it, especially on the east coast".
I seriously hope you're joking with this statement, ...:confused: ....
no, trust me, we feel the effects!!!:mad:
as owners, we're ALL in this together! there is no east side, west side, me or you. it's us. yes, on this east coast, like you,, ALL of you, we fight BSL on a daily basis. BSL doesn't care what color your skin is, how much $ you have in your pocket, or what side of the world you live in. If you own an APBT or any of the other 25+ breeds that people confuse as being a "pit bull", YES, you're affected.
Ever see the list of LEAST friendliest cites in which to bring your dog?
Boston tops out at #7.......

 

I have to disagree with that. I really dont think the blue nose stuff is going to go any where when you have people willing to pay 1500-2000 dollars for a pup. Most people still believe that blue noses are rare and that pit bulls should weigh around 80 lbs. When i take my dog to the vets or pets mart every one thinks hes a mutt and that hes to small to be a pit bull. The vet even said he didnt look like a pit bull, and i can under stany why. when i first went in to the vets office i saw 3 other pit bulls in the lobby and they were all in the 80 lb range. If you google pit bull breeder with out includeing the words game dog, the only thing you will find are blue nose breeders. Since i have been here in san antonio i hgave not seen one game bred looking pit bull out in public. Every pit bull ive seen has been in the 60- 100 lb range

 

and as far as what to do?

Be the best damn dog owner you can possibly be! That means, imo, going above and beyond the average joe, lab owner and taking it a step furthur. Make sure your dogs are UTD on all vaccines. If out in public, clean up after them. Control your dogs around people, carry a parting stick, even if you feel you must do so, indiscriminately, but be prepared, just in case. Attend and speak at ANY and ALL BSL meetings you can possibly attend, write to any and all legislators who are considering BSL in their city or town, and show them why BSL will NOT work and introduce a better, more cost effective solution. Follow your city's dog rules to the letter, especially in terms of 'this breed', which you know will most likely take the heat, God forbid, an altercation should erupt. Fingers point first, at the "pit bull", we all know that. :rolleyes:
Just get out there and be the voice for these animals and help to dispel people's doubts about this breed. City by city, councilors and legislators are trying to enforce this BSL bull shit, just as city by city, imo, the "smart" councilors are also realizing it isn't only a "dog" problem, but an owner problem, and this is where the attention needs to be: on the owners and not specific breeds of dogs. You may think that by "only being one person" your efforts may fall on deaf ears, but as one, I, personally would rather try to make a difference, then do nothing at all. Nobody knows my conscience better than me... I would rather try, than not, so I do, and I not only go to, but speak at every meeting I can possibly get to. I write to councilors all around this country. I spend a lot of time in this chair on behalf of the APBT, but humans have done this to this breed, so as another human, I'm meerly trying to undo it, as well. So can you...

 

wich is why we need to be sure the public gets educated and especialy the vets it is pretty sorry when even a trained vet doesn't know what a ABPT is because all most all of the time they are there and giving their statements during a BSL hearing.and we need to turn up the heat on the bully breeders.

 

I have done research on the Freeman stuff off of Preacher boy,because some of the blood is in one of my males,and got nothing but good news about the blood when kept true(game bred),and most of them run big when inbred .http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=200470 this is my boy,he's a good little scatter bred dog,he's proven he's worth feeding.look at the bottom side.

 

We all feel it. From what I can tell the most liberal of the states it is worst at. Those with the highest amount of Democtrats. Dosen't really matter though. They are the same dick weeds that want helmet laws, seatbelt laws, gun laws, and so on. They fricken law us to death.

Up in Michigan a fat ass cop pulled me over (probably speeding) anyway I set he saw my pistol on the seat next to me and blew a load in his panties. While checking my CWP and my FFL he tried to tell me they were not effective in the state of Michigan. the CWP maybe. But I asked this bright and shinning star from Michigan if he knew what a FFL was. I don't think he realized that all states fall under Federal. Any way he wasted over an hour of my time till a Captain showed up and called him a dip shit (I think that was the term) and said I could leave and sorry about all that. There should be a law against cops that are stupid if we are going to make some laws, make them worth while. Otherwise I think we should ditch 99% of them and not make any new ones. It is a law that you can't ride a bicycle on the federal Highway systems. What kind of jack ass would do that anyway? Does that really have to be a law. That was a waste of tax dollars to even draw up some stupid shit like that. Or the law about jumping off the empire state building. What the hell are they going to do about it if you do. Fine you? shit there will be nothing left. Waste of time and money. There are literally millions of stupid laws. 99% of them are stupid.

Make it simple
Don't take something that isn't yours
don't murder, rape, mess with kids, or anyone elses spouse, no tresspassing and mind your own phuken business. any one caught doing any of these should be hung till dead. Plain and simple. no retrial no apeals. find them guilty and hang them. no more jails. Jails are a waste of time. If it is serious enough hang them. If it is traffic tickets and stupid crap like that leave em alone. Traffic laws for the most part are retarded too. Drive your car on the right side of the road, be conciderat of others and don't be doing it drunk or stoned. Speed limits, seat belts and all that is stupid. For kids yes they should be restrained But for an adult if you dumb enough to ride with out it great, why should I care or any one else for that matter.
Think of it like this, the more people that kill them self in a year the more job openings for the rest of you. Positive light there ey.

There that should sum it up. the rest is bull shit.

 

God has said nobody should kill Cain. The revenge is mine man speaks.Your repayment is nothing against the repayment of God but you risk your soul if you acts against him. I thought you are a Christian?

 

Even Though Im Not A Old Timer, I Was Mentored By One Of The Greatest Dog Men Out There. Basically All We Can Do Now Is Educate And Not Be Afraid To Say What Is Right. I Also Live In California And I Live Next Door To This Guy Who Owns Two Bullies. They Call There Kennel West Coast Bullies And They Always Have Their Dogs In The Front Yard To Show Them Off. I Finally Got Tired Of What I Was Seeing And Simply Asked Him Why Are These Dogs Worthy To Be Bred. All He Said Was That They Are The Hottest Thing Out Now And They Are Making Money. I Snapped, Not Yelling And Screaming At Him, But Just Came Out With Everything. I Told Him How I Felt And How This Breed Is Suppose To Be. I Told Him All His Dogs Are Good For Is Eating, Sleeping, And You Know The Rest. He Asked Me Why A Breed, And I Told Him I Dont Right Now But If I Did It Would Stricly Be Based Off The Ability Of My Dogs Not The Physical Characteristics. If I Want To Start My Dogs Weight Pulling, I Would Breed For The Best Weight Pulling Dogs, The Same Goes For Agility, Huntign, And Other Competions. I Am Aware That We Cant Fight Or Game Test Our Dogs Anymore But We All Know That, That Is Not The Only Thing Our Dogs Are Good For. I've Had My Game Bred Dog For A Year And Even At Her Young Age She Has Shown Me Things That I've Never Thought Dogs Were Capable Of.

At The End Of The Conversation With My Neighbor He Is Now More Interested In Learning More About The Real Apbt Instead Of These Bullies And I Will Continue To Educate Him On The Real Apbt.
I Told Him That I Was Once One Of Those Guys That Thought A Dog Was A Great Dog Because It Looked Like It And I Was Way Off. He Now Visits My House And Observes My Dog And Watches The Things She Does Like Go At The Spring Pole For Hours Or Pull Wieght Back Forth Even Though She Is Exhausted And He Is Blown Away By The Ability My Dog Has.

Basically What We Have To Do Is Not Only Educate And Demand But We Also Have To Show Them Why What They Are Doing Is Hurting Out Breed. I Know If I Can Turn This Guy Around You All Can Do The Same.

 

this is not an accurate statement at all. I think everyone who own's this breed, and even the people that don't own this breed but fights to keep it alive, feels the effects.....

IMO, the thing that should be done now is educate the ignorant as best as you can. Be responsible with your apbt, be even MORE responsible because your actions are what is going to make or break BSL. And don't breed unless you are preserving/bettering the breed. period.....