painter type?

Lrs · Jan 23, 2020

Very true I’m uk based so the only semi legal job for ab here is man work but I played with the idea of using them as a cross for my lurchers just never followed through with it.

Lrs · Jan 23, 2020

LisaWM said: ↑

Lrs
There are some of the lines still around that go back to Sargent rock & Stover's dutchess, Yes they work as catchdogs & have been tested on man. Proven dogs, Jack is a very traditional breeder & only stands behind his dogs when they have proven to be worthy
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Painter lines I tried to find this side of the pond but nothing came off it as I stopped looking after I had my first misunderstanding with the local law. I was always told a catch dog should never go for man if you hunt with it. And vice versa but I love the idea of one dog that can do multiple jobs to a high standard. Learned a lot from this thread thanks everyone.

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

c_note said: ↑

Cody was my dogs sire. View attachment 22908 Not sure if that helped any. I know nothing about ABs peds. I remember a few key names from waaay back but that it. Cody was a farm dog forreal! They had bulls, cows, and horses. The breeder showed me vids of Cody doing catchwork and we went outside while the breeders son tended the animals with Cody. I was impressed at how smart he was. He was the boss and the other animals knew it. A bulldog if I ever seen one! The pup I had I named Hendrix after Jimmi... best dog I ever owned, hands down
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C_Note

A true working bulldog is an impressive thing to see for sure! The first time my old bitch had a bear encounter she was maybe 7 months old, i came outside to sit on the deck with my tea & let her out with me. Next thing I know all hell breaks lose, she charges the bushline & flushes a large male black bear out! She was standing between me & the bear actually holding it off from coming close to the house the second it would try to advance she'd push it back, the bear really seemed confused by the hole thing lol. I dont know how much she weighed then but mature peak condition she was maybe 68lbs & this was all before had done any PP work with her. The only thing i could do was tell her to come & yell out which she did do, the only dog that i had seen similiar to that at that point was a malamute i had as a kid growing up in the sticks lol

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

Lrs said: ↑

Painter lines I tried to find this side of the pond but nothing came off it as I stopped looking after I had my first misunderstanding with the local law. I was always told a catch dog should never go for man if you hunt with it. And vice versa but I love the idea of one dog that can do multiple jobs to a high standard. Learned a lot from this thread thanks everyone.
Click to expand...

Lrs
I'm not sure about other catchdogs just Jack's dogs but I know when he tested his dogs on man they bipassed the sleeve & went for the face, scared the shit out of the decoy

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

Lrs said: ↑

Very true I’m uk based so the only semi legal job for ab here is man work but I played with the idea of using them as a cross for my lurchers just never followed through with it.
Click to expand...

Lrs
I can only imagine the Lurcher/AB x lol, would be some intense dogs. More then likely working homes only type deal

c_note · Jan 23, 2020

LisaWM said: ↑

C_Note
I cant find a pedigree on the Cody dog but I'd say he was definately a hybrid. The head is saying a more mastiff type Bully influence but the body is saying performance. Id be interested in what the pedigree says comparitively to what the dog says lol. Almost want to say a Williamson type in there & Williamson also bred back to Painter lines. Probably some good workers off the Cody dog
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He was a hybrid type and I remember hearing Williamson A LOT over at the farm! Were the Williamson’s black? It’s been a looong time but I think the breeders last name was Williams or Williamson. I’m almost positive his first name was Ron

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

c_note said: ↑

He was a hybrid type and I remember hearing Williamson A LOT over at the farm! Were the Williamson’s black? It’s been a looong time but I think the breeders last name was Williams or Williamson. I’m almost positive his first name was Ron
Click to expand...

C_Note
No the Williamson dogs were very white, you might be thinking of the JEL lines or some of the Johnson dogs with the Black inluence, Scott also had an almost solid Black dog named Black Jack rumoured to be a Carver dog. The Williamson dogs are i believe in Painter, Margentina, Scott, Hines & some OSW & WEB lines

c_note · Jan 23, 2020

LisaWM said: ↑

C_Note
here's an example of an outcross dog that looks somewhat similiar to Bailey's Cody. You see the Performance mixed with mild Mastiff & Beefier look with Koura's Beast. You can see the Painter, Stover & Williamson

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/american_bulldog/dog.html?id=1604983-kouras-beast
Click to expand...

Great looking dog

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

I love the idea of a Bulldog with some colour however most of them today look like a shitty pit outcross they dont look AB & if i wanted a gamedog well then id get a gamedog. What suits me best here is the bulldog size, temp & disposition but white would stick out like a sore thumb i need something that blends into its surroundings better but STILL looks like a proper Bulldog

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

RE: MGK AB lines mentioned earlier above

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/american_bulldog/dog.html?id=1644050-kmks-mac-king-mufassa-of-mgk

Now here is an AB with Painter lineage but unlike most Painter line dogs you are NOT seeing the prepotentcy of the Painter dogs. With this dog you are seeing the West Champs High Hopes EB influence

slim12 · Jan 23, 2020

As far as the book goes, I can only add a little chicken shit to the chicken salad, and after awhile, it just will not be chicken salad anymore. But thanks for the nod.

I think personal handwritten pedigrees worked best, and as soon as pedigrees were attached to the dogs and became apart of the lore, and the selling of puppies, and the keeping of 'family recipes', things simply went south.

It is harder to cross breed a pit bull and still maintain the desire to scratch, with AB's there are a number of dogs that will catch and do man work so it is easier to hide the crosses. If an old english/bully type head does not pop out, who would know? If a heavy Johnson bred dog turns the corner with a 4-5" muzzle, you go, "Hey, wait a minute".

The AB bulldog can come from anywhere. I'm not a computer guy and struggle with uploading pictures. I will make a try over the next few days. We have an English Bulldog. She is CKC registered as there is a boxer in her 7th generation. But she is an English bulldog up one side and down the other. She has dog aggression issues. As long as she is in charge all is well, show some defiance and she will nail anything with fur. And go back. The she rolls over on the A/C vent and gasps for what seems like forever. She is brindle and white.

My son brought home what looked like a 4 week old puppy someone tossed on the side of the road. Tanner turned out to be 30" at the shoulder, he has a bulldog type head, he is brown brindle, long and tall and muscular and his tail fans like a bird dog/retriever.

And as you can tell where I am going, I thought she was out of heat. Not.

She had a shit load of puppies. It was 7-8-9, I can't remember. She spit them out but her teeth are so jacked she could not break the sack or cut the cord. She spit them out, I cut the sack and the cord and she cleaned them up. She raised them all.

We have one female that looked like she could be an inbred Snooty dog. Straight up pit bull look. There were two males that were dark red with a black mask. Straight bulldog look, but thick coarse hair and fanned hair on the tail.

Then the other 6. One was solid white with a brindle patch on her eye. One was mostly white with a brindle saddle. The others were various brindle and whites. They all were perfectly conformed American bulldogs. They had length and muscle. They had performance AB heads. And grew up to be really athletic dogs.

The one thing they all have in common is they are straight killers. One went to my niece and when he was 12 months old he killed a couple of goats, a sheep, killed a calf and ripped up the heifer. The other killed the neighbor's dog and his cat. One killed a fox dog, then went into a pen and killed a couple of small pigs. The number of chickens was countless.

Two were put down and one was shot by the owner of the pigs. And since I own stupid ass Red Boy dogs I can spot retarded bulldog qualities anywhere. One of the males at what looked like two or three pounds of green acorns and the vet could do nothing for him so we put him down.

If someone that can post a video I can send a video from my flip phone to them and they can try to post it here. It is one of these mixed up dogs on a turn table putting in work. PM me a number and I will send a really cool video of a mixed up dog that would pass for an AB.

Great thread.

S

Lrs · Jan 23, 2020

slim12 said: ↑

As far as the book goes, I can only add a little chicken shit to the chicken salad, and after awhile, it just will not be chicken salad anymore. But thanks for the nod.

I think personal handwritten pedigrees worked best, and as soon as pedigrees were attached to the dogs and became apart of the lore, and the selling of puppies, and the keeping of 'family recipes', things simply went south.

It is harder to cross breed a pit bull and still maintain the desire to scratch, with AB's there are a number of dogs that will catch and do man work so it is easier to hide the crosses. If an old english/bully type head does not pop out, who would know? If a heavy Johnson bred dog turns the corner with a 4-5" muzzle, you go, "Hey, wait a minute".

The AB bulldog can come from anywhere. I'm not a computer guy and struggle with uploading pictures. I will make a try over the next few days. We have an English Bulldog. She is CKC registered as there is a boxer in her 7th generation. But she is an English bulldog up one side and down the other. She has dog aggression issues. As long as she is in charge all is well, show some defiance and she will nail anything with fur. And go back. The she rolls over on the A/C vent and gasps for what seems like forever. She is brindle and white.

My son brought home what looked like a 4 week old puppy someone tossed on the side of the road. Tanner turned out to be 30" at the shoulder, he has a bulldog type head, he is brown brindle, long and tall and muscular and his tail fans like a bird dog/retriever.

And as you can tell where I am going, I thought she was out of heat. Not.

She had a shit load of puppies. It was 7-8-9, I can't remember. She spit them out but her teeth are so jacked she could not break the sack or cut the cord. She spit them out, I cut the sack and the cord and she cleaned them up. She raised them all.

We have one female that looked like she could be an inbred Snooty dog. Straight up pit bull look. There were two males that were dark red with a black mask. Straight bulldog look, but thick coarse hair and fanned hair on the tail.

Then the other 6. One was solid white with a brindle patch on her eye. One was mostly white with a brindle saddle. The others were various brindle and whites. They all were perfectly conformed American bulldogs. They had length and muscle. They had performance AB heads. And grew up to be really athletic dogs.

The one thing they all have in common is they are straight killers. One went to my niece and when he was 12 months old he killed a couple of goats, a sheep, killed a calf and ripped up the heifer. The other killed the neighbor's dog and his cat. One killed a fox dog, then went into a pen and killed a couple of small pigs. The number of chickens was countless.

Two were put down and one was shot by the owner of the pigs. And since I own stupid ass Red Boy dogs I can spot retarded bulldog qualities anywhere. One of the males at what looked like two or three pounds of green acorns and the vet could do nothing for him so we put him down.

If someone that can post a video I can send a video from my flip phone to them and they can try to post it here. It is one of these mixed up dogs on a turn table putting in work. PM me a number and I will send a really cool video of a mixed up dog that would pass for an AB.

Great thread.

S
Click to expand...

Lol sounds similar to owning lurchers no matter how tight you breed there still crossbreeds so you never can fully predict how there gonna look until a year or two.

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

slim12 said: ↑

As far as the book goes, I can only add a little chicken shit to the chicken salad, and after awhile, it just will not be chicken salad anymore. But thanks for the nod.

I think personal handwritten pedigrees worked best, and as soon as pedigrees were attached to the dogs and became apart of the lore, and the selling of puppies, and the keeping of 'family recipes', things simply went south.

It is harder to cross breed a pit bull and still maintain the desire to scratch, with AB's there are a number of dogs that will catch and do man work so it is easier to hide the crosses. If an old english/bully type head does not pop out, who would know? If a heavy Johnson bred dog turns the corner with a 4-5" muzzle, you go, "Hey, wait a minute".

The AB bulldog can come from anywhere. I'm not a computer guy and struggle with uploading pictures. I will make a try over the next few days. We have an English Bulldog. She is CKC registered as there is a boxer in her 7th generation. But she is an English bulldog up one side and down the other. She has dog aggression issues. As long as she is in charge all is well, show some defiance and she will nail anything with fur. And go back. The she rolls over on the A/C vent and gasps for what seems like forever. She is brindle and white.

My son brought home what looked like a 4 week old puppy someone tossed on the side of the road. Tanner turned out to be 30" at the shoulder, he has a bulldog type head, he is brown brindle, long and tall and muscular and his tail fans like a bird dog/retriever.

And as you can tell where I am going, I thought she was out of heat. Not.

She had a shit load of puppies. It was 7-8-9, I can't remember. She spit them out but her teeth are so jacked she could not break the sack or cut the cord. She spit them out, I cut the sack and the cord and she cleaned them up. She raised them all.

We have one female that looked like she could be an inbred Snooty dog. Straight up pit bull look. There were two males that were dark red with a black mask. Straight bulldog look, but thick coarse hair and fanned hair on the tail.

Then the other 6. One was solid white with a brindle patch on her eye. One was mostly white with a brindle saddle. The others were various brindle and whites. They all were perfectly conformed American bulldogs. They had length and muscle. They had performance AB heads. And grew up to be really athletic dogs.

The one thing they all have in common is they are straight killers. One went to my niece and when he was 12 months old he killed a couple of goats, a sheep, killed a calf and ripped up the heifer. The other killed the neighbor's dog and his cat. One killed a fox dog, then went into a pen and killed a couple of small pigs. The number of chickens was countless.

Two were put down and one was shot by the owner of the pigs. And since I own stupid ass Red Boy dogs I can spot retarded bulldog qualities anywhere. One of the males at what looked like two or three pounds of green acorns and the vet could do nothing for him so we put him down.

If someone that can post a video I can send a video from my flip phone to them and they can try to post it here. It is one of these mixed up dogs on a turn table putting in work. PM me a number and I will send a really cool video of a mixed up dog that would pass for an AB.

Great thread.

S
Click to expand...

Slim,
I can add a little chicken shit to the chicken salad lol
My friend Jack still does the hand written pedigrees, to which i was just telling him he can do those online & his response was similar to yours in regards to computers lol. There are those that say there's Black mouth cur, Mountain Cur & pointer in the AB, I actually agree same with the Delee dogs having Boxer in them. I know with the JEL lines you really see the Boudreaux dogs throwing themselves both in type & disposition.

My thoughts on the farm utility type AB, When the America's had an influx of UK immigrants the dogs needed to adapt & evolve to serve a purpose to be a necessity and an integral part of the farm. The dogs needed to be protectors the families survival in some cases depended on it. Being new to a country & destitute they couldnt have their dogs running around killing very much needed livestock. Times are a but different now in that farms arent needed nor are the farm utility dogs more of a hobbiest thing. In regards to your litter of pups Ive heard the same thing with old very old johnson lines in having pups that looked like 3 different breeds in a single litter (LeClerc started with Johnson dogs in the 80's as well as Jack in the late 80's early 90's & both got out because of this no prepotentcy) The Delee dogs were the same very scattered looking with no consistency. Id love to see pictures of the white dogs in the litter you had, I'd bet the more true Bulldog type were the whites.

Snooty, has that Bulldog look about him. I had the hey wait a minute episode with an AB named Watchdogs Battlin Bertha, identicle to a Painter dog but the paperwork said solid Johnson lol. hmmm. My black brindle bitch is great with dogs unless they try to pull rank with her, if they challenge her & wont submit thats a whole other ball game. Her daughter is half Delee lines & really shes more of a loud rough cur. Never bred her, Unfortunately didnt know about the painter lines at the time while looking for a male to put to my brindle dog

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/american_bulldog/dog.html?id=1445278-delees-dozer

son to Delee's Dozer
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/american_bulldog/dog.html?id=1587371-leclercsvogelpohls-chopper

great grandson to Delee's Dozer
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/american_bulldog/dog.html?id=1581826-ch-hyspots-twister

son of Boudreax's Maverick
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/american_bulldog/dog.html?id=1636057-lichthardts-jedi

Scott's Black Jack, Rumour is he was a Carver dog direct from Carver
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/american_bulldog/dog.html?id=1774259-scotts-dixie-black-jack

My Buckskin bitch goes back to LeClerc's Chopper

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

My Buckskins dam
LeClerc’s Chopper & my bitch on the right she’s a great great granddaughter of his

slim12 · Jan 23, 2020

I am digging on the the dog with the spiked collar.

For me, that look says he can do just about anything. Good muzzle length, height and mass, but not so much mass he looks bulky and would struggle carrying it in the heat.

I see a lot of snow in the pics so not sure about the heat/humidity there.

Here in the south, that is one of the first things that makes one check up, regardless of the breed.

S

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

slim12 said: ↑

I am digging on the the dog with the spiked collar.

For me, that look says he can do just about anything. Good muzzle length, height and mass, but not so much mass he looks bulky and would struggle carrying it in the heat.

I see a lot of snow in the pics so not sure about the heat/humidity there.

Here in the south, that is one of the first things that makes one check up, regardless of the breed.

S
Click to expand...

Slim
She can do anything lol, actually we do have pretty tough winters but summer is also relatively hot I know it’s been over 41c here & they are fine I’ve run them in sandpits to see how they handle the heat with no issues

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

LisaWM said: ↑

Slim
She can do anything lol, actually we do have pretty tough winters but summer is also relatively hot I know it’s been over 41c here & they are fine I’ve run them in sandpits to see how they handle the heat with no issues
Click to expand...

40 here would be 100-105 Fahrenheit

LisaWM · Jan 23, 2020

And she had just had a litter after that picture so she was a bit leaned out. Under her 68lbs for sure

slim12 · Jan 23, 2020

This is one of the mixed breed pups we had on the accidental breeding.

He is hog fat and is a wonderful family dog. Just hates other fury creatures.

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painter type?

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